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8th Ed. new lizard player - need help with 1000 pts

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Tannis

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looking for some tips on my list, as well as general advice on playstyle and so forth. im pretty expirenced in whfb, mainly with ogres and empire. anyhow, here is my first draft


old one on coldone, halbred, shield and light armor.

scar vet, light armor, shield, bsb
skink priest lvl 2

17 warriors, fc
10 skinks

10 cold one riders, standard
=1000

my generalplan is to use the skinks as flank harrasment to funnel the opposing side into the middle towards the saurus. cold ones support as suitable. the bsb and old one join the warriors and riders respectivly. and the skink priest joins the warriors.
 
Tannis said:
looking for some tips on my list, as well as general advice on playstyle and so forth. im pretty expirenced in whfb, mainly with ogres and empire. anyhow, here is my first draft


old one on coldone, halbred, shield and light armor.

scar vet, light armor, shield, bsb
skink priest lvl 2

17 warriors, fc
10 skinks

10 cold one riders, standard
=1000

my generalplan is to use the skinks as flank harrasment to funnel the opposing side into the middle towards the saurus. cold ones support as suitable. the bsb and old one join the warriors and riders respectivly. and the skink priest joins the warriors.
Click to expand...

I am still a newb as well, but a few things occur to me.

No reroll/special saves on your characters
No dispell scroll (wish I had one yesterday)

10 cold ones is very expensive and probably massive overkill in a 1000 game

A unit of 6 might give you more points for troops / other selections etc...?

Good luck !!
 
CoR in the second rank lose 75% of their damage output. Whey work better as a single rank of 5-8 models, as that is what you're paying for.
 
hmmm so, if i drop the cold one riders (cor?) to a 6 wide single rank, and add the old one for a 7 wide unit, then use the points for maybe a few items on him and a dispel scroll?

something like this:

-4 CoR

oldblood w/ cold one, halbred, shield, light armor, stegadon helm, talisman of preservation

add a dispel scroll to the skink priest, and standard of discipline to the bsb.

this gives me the dispel scroll, a better save and toughness + ward on my general, while reducing the CoR to a more usable frontage.
 
Tannis said:
hmmm so, if i drop the cold one riders (cor?) to a 6 wide single rank, and add the old one for a 7 wide unit, then use the points for maybe a few items on him and a dispel scroll?

something like this:

-4 CoR

oldblood w/ cold one, halbred, shield, light armor, stegadon helm, talisman of preservation

add a dispel scroll to the skink priest, and standard of discipline to the bsb.

this gives me the dispel scroll, a better save and toughness + ward on my general, while reducing the CoR to a more usable frontage.
Click to expand...

Very sensible...
 
mipevo6 said:
Tannis said:
hmmm so, if i drop the cold one riders (cor?) to a 6 wide single rank, and add the old one for a 7 wide unit, then use the points for maybe a few items on him and a dispel scroll?

something like this:

-4 CoR

oldblood w/ cold one, halbred, shield, light armor, stegadon helm, talisman of preservation

add a dispel scroll to the skink priest, and standard of discipline to the bsb.

this gives me the dispel scroll, a better save and toughness + ward on my general, while reducing the CoR to a more usable frontage.
Click to expand...

Very sensible...
Click to expand...

Something that has just come up on my discussion.

The scarvet cannot be BSB and general, hence your general becomes the skink priest at ld 6 :(

How do people get around this?
 
The old blood is the general :)

no reason to have light armour and shield on the old blood. you can't have better than 1+ save anyway.
old blood on cold-one is 2+, so you need only helmet, or LA to give him 1+ with a halbard.
 
i was under the impression lizzies could make the same guy general and bsb.. or was that just slaan?

otherwise i was intending the old one to be general, with the skarvet as bsb and the skink for magic support. as for his armor - i have him modeled with a shield, so ill probally keep that, cause it looks cool.
 
The General is the character with highest leadership. If two equal, choose. Lizardmen BSB is stated in lists as being if not Mazadamundi, then a slann Mage priest or scar vet. Or skink chief can be BSB.
 
so heres another question then.....

as far as units themselves go, should i bother with temple gaurd and cold one riders? they look decent, but i think points *might* be better spent elsewhere. such as something like a stegadon... list would looki like:

oldblood, stegadon helm, pirahna blade, seed of rebirth, cold one, LA/shield (gives me a 2+ armor, 6+regen and 5 str 6 ap d3multi wound attacks, while im rocking a t6. - he should be a beast in a fight.

scar vet, halbred, LA, shield, bsb, standard of discipline
skink priest, lvl 2, beasts, dispel scroll

(both heros go in the saurus unit giving me easyier acsess to the beast buffs and ld 9 )

13 saurus warriors, spears, shields, standard
10 skink skirmishers

ancient stegadon. stampede
=995

not sure what to do with 5 pts.

originally i had a larger group of saurus, but realized i only had 2 units aside from characters (im pretty sure the old one on cold one dosent count) so i had to trim the saurus block to add the skinks, wich also gives me some ranged support and redirecting unit to work with. i think the idea here, is to hold center with saurus and skinks, and use the steg as a battering ram to smash what needs smooshing. the old one goes where needed to beat face. thoughts?
 
Hmm... I am a newb so pinch of salt with my comments.

I guess I am feeling like you just don't have enough troops to be able to fight properly.

Dropping the steg and adding more Saurus and skinks and maybe something like 5 cold ones would give you more flexibility and more targets for enemy shooting.

I am feeling like your very character heavy tbh for such a low number of points for the game.

Martin
 
You will struggle against lists with 1-2 canons.
None of the characters have a descent wardsave, and no Look out sir!
The steg is also quite vulnerable, and you don't really have anything in the list that are good at dealing with canons.

If you drop the steg and add about 8 cold ones, you will have look out sir. I would also drop the discipline banner, keep him as BSB and give him some descent fighting equipment instead. GW, dragonhelm, light armour, dawnstone (and maybe other tricksters shard) or GW, gamblers armour, dawnstone or GW, armour of destiny. And with the piranhablade on a lord I would consider Charmed shield and luckstone.

That way you would have a strong bus at low points. If you face a MSU list who just redirects you, they can split up and you have 3 quite good chargers, instead of just one heavy hitter.
 
Alternatively you could run a smaller group of CoR (6 with musician for example), and a bastiladon. Bastiladons are awesome at low point games, and they aren't overly expensive, so losing one to a cannonball wont make the game.

Remember that the old blood has 4+ scaly skin, so along with the cold one and stegadon helm, he is rocking a 1+ armour save! Awesome!
 
Yea I was sort of wondering about being light on guys. Figure the steg might make up for it. Guess not. Will brig him in on 1500 pts.

So a revised list, lost a character and added MOAR. Guys

- scar vet armor of destiny, halberd, light armor shield.
- skink priest, lvl 2, dispel scroll, channel staff

18 Saurus warriors, standard
10 skink skirmishers
10 temple guard
5 cold ones.
Bastililldon.
=1000

Both characters join the Saurus. Bastilidon takes up middile to Max it's abilitys. Temple and slinks provide flank coverage for it. Cold ones attack flank and go for cannons.

Maybe drop the priests channel staff for a standard on the cor?
 
Tannis said:
Yea I was sort of wondering about being light on guys. Figure the steg might make up for it. Guess not. Will brig him in on 1500 pts.

So a revised list, lost a character and added MOAR. Guys

- scar vet armor of destiny, halberd, light armor shield.
- skink priest, lvl 2, dispel scroll, channel staff

18 Saurus warriors, standard
10 skink skirmishers
10 temple guard
5 cold ones.
Bastililldon.
=1000

Both characters join the Saurus. Bastilidon takes up middile to Max it's abilitys. Temple and slinks provide flank coverage for it. Cold ones attack flank and go for cannons.

Maybe drop the priests channel staff for a standard on the cor?
Click to expand...

Me again :)

How about swapping the Halberd for a GW ? some mighty big hits then..

TBH I wouldn't bother with the TG, they are too small to make a difference.

How about beefing up the Saurus block to 25 ?

Just some things to think about....
 
I originally had a gw but was too points heavy. So switched to halberd.

I was thinking the tg would be able to provide support for the Saurus by charging a flank of whatever they fight or vice versa. I do however like the idea of bumping up my core horde of Saurus. For the pts. Could add 12 more Saurus making the unit 30 strong. I would have to try out both ideas to see wich one works best.
 
so i played my first game at 1000 pts. my list:

scar vet, halbred, armor of destiny, shield.
skink priest, lvl 2, dispel scroll, channel staff.

18 saurus, standard
10 temple gaurd
10 skinks
5 cold one riders
bastilidon w/ solar engine

vrs WOC

exalted on demon steed (had poison attacks, armor of destiny and soulfeeder) i think

20 warriors with halbreds, standard of discipline, fc
5 hellstriders, standard
chaos chariot
mutalith vortex beast.

(i realize mid gae my skink priest has 2 arcane items and is illegal so i drop the scroll)

mission was battle line. no magic from chaos side, i rolled up a 1 and a 6, so take wyssans and kadon. chaos goes first...

TURN 1:
the chaos army moved a touch closer, otherwise not mch happened. my turn i was able to fry 6 chaos warriors with the solor engine (miscasting its power and getting a 6 on its effect - (and i LOVE innate bound spells now...) additonally my skink priest throws caution to the wind and turns himself into a gigantic f'ing dragon... but nukes off his wizard levels and all his spells in the process.

turn 2 the chaos forces attacked, hellstriders smashed into my cold ones, but the chariot was too slow. the chaos warrior block advanced, as did the vortex beast. wich failed to get off its power on the skinks on my left flank. the cold ones promptly kicked hellstrider ass, and sent them packing with 1 guy left. i held ground. meanwhile the dragon flew off and torched a few more chaos warriors from behind. and the skinks put 2 wounds on the vortex beast with thier darts. i tried charging the chariot with my now freed up cold ones, but he fled and i was unable to catch him.

turn 3: the vortex charged the skinks, who failed terror and got ran down. he also dispelled my dragon, leaving my skink priest all by himself and scared in the middile of the field. his hellstriders and chariot regrouped, while his boss charged my riders and cut down 3 of them, forcing them to flee. his wasrriors also charged my saurus, who held firm and won the fight, but he passed his check.

turn 4:
i regrouped the cold ones, ready to face the chaos lord again, reformed my temple gaurd to help, while the bastilidon lazerbeamed the vortex beast off the table. the saurus finished beating down the chaos warriors, but the chaos lord wiped out my riders

turn 5:
the chaos lord charged into my temple gaurd, and over his turn and mine, wiped them out. his last hellstrider charged my lone priest, and through 2 rounds took him down. the chariot held back, and my saurus heldground preparing to fight the chaos lord. the bastilidon couldnt get off his attack, and eventually got charged. broken but managed to BARLEY escape, and regroup.

turn 6:
the chaos lord recharged the bastilidon, but failed to kill it. otherwise not much happened. end result:

i managed to kill his chaos warriors, and his vortex beast, while he wiped out my temple gaurd, skinks, priest, and riders. but the pricey stuff (saurus unit, scar vet and bastilidon) still survived. i ended up having 57 pts more then him on the score, netting the draw.

decided to tweak the list, removing the dispel scroll from the skink priest, and using his 25 pts to give my temple gaurd a standard and making it a standard of discipline. i also learned i dont like skink skirmishers. they cant be relied on for shooting, and really cant redirect much. i figure the points are better spent beefing up the saurus to a larger size. i also LOVE the bastilidon... its lazer beam of doom is awsome, and packs a nice punch for its pts. all in all a great first game for the lizzies.
 
congrats!
No real point in having shield on the scar-vet, since he has a halbard. Could use the points on great weapon instead!
 
first, just wanted to say thanks for the ongoing help with the list so far. ive learned a ton, and apreciate the replies.
i think its better for me to maintain this thread (for the 1000pts mark) then start a new one - so ive come up with an experimental list.... again for 1000 pts

first and foremost, in my last (and only game so far) i noticed a few things. stupidity on cold ones SUCK. that and they dont really hold up to other calvary. for fun my buddie and i ran a few fights with his chaos knights vrs equal points in COR and his knights won every time. so im thinking the points for them ...better used elsewhere. second, temple gaurd are an interesting idea, but this seems to me to strike very familiar to the ogres ironguts vrs bulls debate. i like using a massive brick of dudes at my center, supported by faster moving stuff. (in my ogres army this was/is a horde of bulls flanked by mournfangs, ironblasters, maneaters, leadies and so on) so with that in mind:

skink priest, lvl 1, beasts.
scar vet, armor of destiny, GW, cold one.

20 saurus, full command.
bastilidon, solar engine
stegadon
salamanders (2 packs)

this build runs in at 994... and heres what im thinking. (please correct me if im wrong)

the bastilidon and steg run either side of the saurus. and provide ranged attacks and a big "dont F with me" line. the salamanders run up one side torching what they can. (eventually ill use high magic to fly them in behind enemy lines >:) ) the priest just hides behind or in the saurus unit providing buffs. while the scar vet takes off and hunts war machines or anything else he can get ahold of. eventually he will get a carnosaur to do the same thing but better. - and he does have a nice 1+/4++ save, and 4 str 7 attacks at ws 5. he should smash pretty much anything short of a hellcannon in one go. (was considering the steg helm, but no ward save on a lone cowboy makes me nervous, especially as he is the general in this list)

ive still got 4 units + characters, 2 of wich are beasties that not only provide nice combat support but good ranged attacks. the saurus unit did AWSOME in my last game, so they stay in of course. and i have a war machine hunting character to run around with and beat face, or at the very least draw attention away from my main line. thoughts?
 
I would leave the BSB at home at 1000pts. So here's what I would do:

- Oldblood W/ cold one, armour of destiny, dawnstone and halbard. You can't get a better general than this. Trust me he's almost unkillable to anything less than S6.

- priest w/ scroll and lvl2.

- 24 saurus full command.

- 6 COR, only musician.

- bastiladon.

should there be points left you can try and get ruby ring of fire on your priest.

You'll then have a decent anvil (saurus), decent magic (4 different spells) and a very tanke and decently killy general.
The bastiladon is support for your saurus and can cast the bound spell with little risk and high reward.
 
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