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GW News: LAS VEGAS OPEN 2025

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Considering we might got teased with a moonclub for plastic kroxigors, I'm high on dreamium and hopium to see boxigors from TWWII. Maybe the kit will allow for Nakai as an optional assembly just like Tiktaq'to and flying Skink Chief. Man, I can almost taste it.

Lord Agragax of Lunaxoatl said:
Fine for a Saurus BSB, no issues there apart from the usual fat feet and short jaws. I wish they would kick that sculptor who's been sculpting Saurus since the Carnosaur kit and bring back the one who sculpted the first plastic Oldblood. He knew what Saurus were all about.
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Jaws are short because you are seeing him from frontal view.

Also, tastes are tastes, I might be the biggest stan for current Cold Ones ever, they look like living codices (that's how you call mesoamerican glyphs), but in my imho, the first plastic Oldblood, the one with mace and sculpted base, right? is bland as heck
 
Nice model, shame it doesn't appear to have any actually updated rules though, just the same it's been for a while now.
Partially because it's not a terribly interesting model rulewise, being relegated to mostly just standing next to the slann, but also, and more importantly because the very first rule they "tease" is literally just an existing rule.

Kinda makes it appear like the battletome itself won't be much of a real update. Not a great sign.
 
Warden said:
Cool model, but why did the glyphs have to be gibberish?! Missed a great opportunity for an Easter egg there.

Cool looking saurus, his mask is interesting didn’t think he had a face at first.
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Agreed.
As far as I can tell, using the old Lizardmen alphabet, the Astrolith does not spell out anything in English. A couple of my choices of glyph may be off and GW has added a couple glyphs of which I'm unsure.

Reading from the top of the Astrolith down the glyphs are
H, A, B, ?, 3, G, L, CH or Z, X, W or U, Q, D, O, M

Reversed it would be
M, O, D, Q, W or U, X, CH or Z, L, G, 3, ?, B, A, H

Anyone see anything?
 
Cristhian MLR said:
Jaws are short because you are seeing him from frontal view.
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Not really, the jaws on all new Saurus since the Carnosaur kit are particularly short, it's the way this sculptor has designed them, and unfortunately Warhammer II Total War seemed to follow his design. He seems to think that the dominant feature of Saurus is the chest, that they should be as bulky as wrestlers. While this does follow some of the established lore given they were bred to fight, personally I think this makes them look more like reptilian Orcs or Ogres than proper Lizardmen. Orcs and Ogres fight with fists and weapons first and foremost, so making them look like dim, brawny boxers fits them well.

On the other hand, I have always seen the jaws as the dominant feature of Saurus - they're natural predators, so they should have particularly long, powerful jaws brimming with long, sharp teeth to sink into and grip the flesh of prey. Where Orcs would punch an enemy first, a Saurus would tear out the enemy's throat with his teeth first, and should have jaws to match. More than that, I think biting as a weapon is something that should set humanoid reptilians apart from other humanoids, as it does in the real world - the jaws of these new Saurus look more like the comparatively short jaws of a gorilla than the long jaws of a crocodile or Komodo Dragon.

A big case in point is Gor-Rok - I particularly liked his illustration from the 7th Edition Lizardman book, which perfectly showcases what long-jawed Saurus look like:
latest


This is why I like the first plastic Oldblood, as he followed this sort of style - a lean, mean fighting machine with his jaws being the dominant feature:
99070208001_SaurusOldbloodNEW01.jpg

This guy really looks like, though he has a mace, he would willingly throw it to the ground and tear your head off with his jaws, if that was what it took to enforce the Great Plan. He has a set of teeth a prey-creature could really fear.

In fact, he looks pretty similar to the 7th Edition Gor-Rok illustration. I certainly wouldn't complain if someone fielded him with his scales painted white and said 'He's Gor-Rok'.


Compare this with the new Gor-Rok art and model:
latest

99800208027_SaurusSunBlood01.jpg



Look how fat his arms are, how ripped his chest is and how short his jaws, claws and teeth are - he looks more like an armoured humanoid ankylosaur (without the shell or tail club) than a predator. I thought this version of him was a significant downgrade from his previous illustrated incarnation.

Cristhian MLR said:
Also, tastes are tastes, I might be the biggest stan for current Cold Ones ever, they look like living codices (that's how you call mesoamerican glyphs),
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I'm also a fan of the current Cold Ones, they look more unusual, fantastical and original, compared to the blatant velociraptor rip-offs that are ridden by the Dark Elf Cold One Knights.


As you say, it's all about taste, but here are the reasons for mine.
 
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Canas said:
Good luck convincing someone to play against proxies and old models half the size (or smaller) of their current, official, counterparts, on any sort of regular basis. And have fun arguing that only like 30% of Kroak's model should count for LoS cuz the rest is floating debris...
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  1. I don't play Age of Sigmar, so I don't need to convince anyone of anything. I have no skin in this game. I'm literally an outside party with nothing to win or lose in regards to this matter.
  2. It isn't that hard to win a debate when my viewpoint has been entirely informed by and in concordance with the actual rules of the game. I don't think you're reading the room right. Look back at our discussion and see where the support has fallen.
  3. If we were in a room of players debating this very topic before settling into a game, I'm the one arguing to let everyone play the game while you're the one trying to disallow people from participating. It's pretty obvious who would be viewed as the villain of the bunch.






Just remembering the time when my buddy was the manager of a Games Workshop and banned all the goobers from the store. He also invoked hygiene standards :D
 
NIGHTBRINGER said:
  1. I don't play Age of Sigmar, so I don't need to convince anyone of anything. I have no skin in this game. I'm literally an outside party with nothing to win or lose in regards to this matter.
  2. It isn't that hard to win a debate when my viewpoint has been entirely informed by and in concordance with the actual rules of the game. I don't think you're reading the room right. Look back at our discussion and see where the support has fallen.
  3. If we were in a room of players debating this very topic before settling into a game, I'm the one arguing to let everyone play the game while you're the one trying to disallow people from participating. It's pretty obvious who would be viewed as the villain of the bunch.

Just remembering the time when my buddy was the manager of a Games Workshop and banned all the goobers from the store. He also invoked hygiene standards :D
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Dude, let it go already, you think it's more important to allow people to play with their old models no matter how outdated, I think it's more important for those models (or any proxies for the current model really) to at least be appropriately sized compared to their current counterparts. And if that makes me a villain, then honestly you have a pretty low threshold for villainy. (Minor caveat, there's of course a difference in expectations regarding accurately sized models between say 10 year old Timmy's who barely has a collection worth 1500 points and say a competitive player who owns 20.000 points worth of just one faction...)

As for what the actual rules are. Based on the rules and stuff like white dwarf interviews that mention LoS, I don't think that's the rules. Or at the very least not RAI, as whenever they mention LoS in an article they are extremely explicit to mention that some flexibility is required, especially where height is concerned, due to the various heroic poses, flying debris, and whatnot, not exactly being realistic when a model is supposed to be in cover. The only thing they're consistently very strict about is that you should never alter a model in such a way that would alter LoS, for example when kitbashing, but there's also been some articles where they mention sticking flyers on really small stands to be able to hide them, or kitbashing a model that's normally jumping, like say SCE prosecutors, to be on the ground, or altering the wing-positions to minimize their profile. Suddenly being completly cavalier about using a model that's half the size of the current "official" model would be rather inconsistent with how carefully they generally discuss alterations that affect LoS.

If it is the RAI then honestly, it's inconsistent at best, and just kinda silly at worst, depending on how large the size difference in question are.

Anyways, we're not going to agree, just let it be and move on to this new astrolith bearer already.
 
Lord Agragax of Lunaxoatl said:
Not really, the jaws on all new Saurus since the Carnosaur kit are particularly short, it's the way this sculptor has designed them, and unfortunately Warhammer II Total War seemed to follow his design. He seems to think that the dominant feature of Saurus is the chest, that they should be as bulky as wrestlers. While this does follow some of the established lore given they were bred to fight, personally I think this makes them look more like reptilian Orcs or Ogres than proper Lizardmen. Orcs and Ogres fight with fists and weapons first and foremost, so making them look like dim, brawny boxers fits them well.

On the other hand, I have always seen the jaws as the dominant feature of Saurus - they're natural predators, so they should have particularly long, powerful jaws brimming with long, sharp teeth to sink into and grip the flesh of prey. Where Orcs would punch an enemy first, a Saurus would tear out the enemy's throat with his teeth first, and should have jaws to match. More than that, I think biting as a weapon is something that should set humanoid reptilians apart from other humanoids, as it does in the real world - the jaws of these new Saurus look more like the comparatively short jaws of a gorilla than the long jaws of a crocodile or Komodo Dragon.
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Short jaws might not be terribly for biting. Apparently there's some specific optimum for human jaws (scientific article, happened to be the first hit on google when I tried searching for it, interesting if you're a doctor I guess :P), and apparently being short faced is better for humans.

More generally though, bears, gorillas and felines all have pretty short jaws, but are more than capable of terrifying bites. All of them are massivly more powerfull than Komodo's apparently. Though vastly outclassed by crocodiles, aligators, and hippo's.
 
Just A Skink said:
Agreed.
As far as I can tell, using the old Lizardmen alphabet, the Astrolith does not spell out anything in English. A couple of my choices of glyph may be off and GW has added a couple glyphs of which I'm unsure.

Reading from the top of the Astrolith down the glyphs are
H, A, B, ?, 3, G, L, CH or Z, X, W or U, Q, D, O, M

Reversed it would be
M, O, D, Q, W or U, X, CH or Z, L, G, 3, ?, B, A, H

Anyone see anything?
Click to expand...

Yeah that's about what I got too. Can't make sense of it, and I feel like with the Z, X, Q, and the #3 it is unlikely that there was any deeper meaning than gibberish :(.

That's ok, I am driving to a conference this week where I am taking a two-day introductory class on how to decipher Maya hieroglyphs. To say that I am excited would be an understatement :bookworm::D:D:D
 
Canas said:
Dude, let it go already
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You can let it go anytime you'd like. Don't try to pin it on me... it takes two to tango. You have replied to my posts just as I've replied to yours. Don't play victim.

Canas said:
you think it's more important to allow people to play with their old models no matter how outdated, I think it's more important for those models (or any proxies for the current model really) to at least be appropriately sized compared to their current counterparts.
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You do... even when in utter contrast to the rules of the game.

I care about what the rules state.

That said, you are partially right. Even if GW changed the rules and outright stated that you can't field the old Kroak model, I'd still try to find a way to accommodate an opponent who only had the old model and wanted to play game. I would however be reluctant to try to field the old model myself (because the rules are the rules), and never against someone's protest. As a general rule though, if someone wanted to field the old model in good faith, we'd come up with a reasonable way to handle it. We'd discuss it and find a house-rule that everyone is happy with. It's supposed to be a fun game. I don't want to be "that guy" who tells someone they are not allowed to play because their version of the kroak model is missing the crap pile of rocks that is floating around the new model.

As luck would have it though, rules forbidding the use of the old Kroak model only exist in the figments of your imagination. So it's a moot point anyways. :)

Canas said:
And if that makes me a villain, then honestly you have a pretty low threshold for villainy.
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Villain in the context of a group of players trying to have fun playing a game. Let's not play semantic games here. You're the guy trying to exclude players from playing what is essentially a "beer and pretzels" game. You're lucky that your neck of the woods is evidently more lenient on that kind of behavior. In my area, you'd be the one who'd quickly find himself without an opponent, game or place to play.

This is the type of behavior that gives our hobby a bad rap.

Canas said:
Anyways, we're not going to agree, just let it be and move on to this new astrolith bearer already.
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You're more than welcome to leave it be. This can end right here and now. I think we've probably exceeded our yearly limit of forum interaction with one another!

Move along.
 
I really like this new astrolith bearer. I'm not the biggest fan of the new saurus model headcrests being so scaly so the mask makes everything work for me. I do wonder if we are getting temple guard updates? I really hope they still have skull helmets if we do. I love skull helmets as a design but recent stuff seems very metal oriented and a bit less feral.
 
Warden said:
Yeah that's about what I got too. Can't make sense of it, and I feel like with the Z, X, Q, and the #3 it is unlikely that there was any deeper meaning than gibberish :(.

That's ok, I am driving to a conference this week where I am taking a two-day introductory class on how to decipher Maya hieroglyphs. To say that I am excited would be an understatement :bookworm::D:D:D
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That sounds fun
 
Astrolith bearer is excellent.

Sending up prayers to dracothian I get my broad headed powerfist kroxigors from wh2/3
 
Croco Guard said:
I do wonder if we are getting temple guard updates? I really hope they still have skull helmets if we do. I love skull helmets as a design but recent stuff seems very metal oriented and a bit less feral.
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I'm pretty sure the skull helmet will stay, after all it was already like that in 5th edition when all warriors and guards had metal/gold shields
 
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