AoS Thinking of going to my first tournament...

[Kilvakar]

So what do you all think of these list ideas? I have absolutely no idea about who will be playing what, this is the first time I've been to any tournament and I'm honestly quite nervous, as all my games have been casual so far and I'm still not that great. But I do know Seraphon pretty well by this point, and I'm eager to start playing against more stuff than just my friends' Orks, Khorne, Gitz and Idoneth. I know he's not amazing at tournaments, but I kind of like the idea of bringing Lord Kroak to my first tournament just to show him the respect he deserves So my first list idea is:

Allegiance: Seraphon
- Constellation: Thunder Lizard
- Grand Strategy: Hold the Line
- Triumphs: Inspired

Leaders
Lord Kroak (430)*
Engine of the Gods (265)***
- General
- Command Trait: Prime Warbeast
- Artefact: Cloak of Feathers
- Mount Trait: Beastmaster
- Universal Prayer Scripture: Curse
Saurus Astrolith Bearer (150)*
- Artefact: Fusil of Conflaguration
Skink Starpriest (130)*
- Spell: Hand of Glory

Battleline
10 x Saurus Guard (230)**
- Reinforced x 1
30 x Skinks (225)**
- Meteoric Javelins Celestite Daggers & Star Bucklers
- Reinforced x 2
20 x Skinks (150)*
- Meteoric Javelins Celestite Daggers & Star Bucklers
- Reinforced x 1

Units
3 x Kroxigor (150)***

Behemoths
Bastiladon with Solar Engine (250)***

Endless Spells & Invocations
The Burning Head (20)

Core Battalions
*Warlord
**Hunters of the Heartlands
***Thunderquake - Slayers

Additional Enhancements
Artefact

Total: 2000 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 4 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 132
Drops: 9

This list gets me a decent wound count, and a serious castle threat if I keep Kroak, his Guard, and the Astrolith together and keep the Engine and Bastiladon near them. The 30 Skinks and Starpriest can do some work on another part of the board, and 20 more Skinks can either screen something or go grab objectives. Kroxigors can be deployed pretty much anywhere near Skinks and hit anything that attacks them. I'm not sure if it would be better to drop some of the Guard to reinforce the 20 Skinks again, or even to split them into two groups for better melee coverage when Kroak gets close to the enemy.

My second list idea:

Allegiance: Seraphon
- Constellation: Thunder Lizard
- Grand Strategy: Beast Master
- Triumphs: Inspired

Leaders
Engine of the Gods (265)*
- General
- Command Trait: Prime Warbeast
- Artefact: Cloak of Feathers
- Mount Trait: Beastmaster
- Universal Prayer Scripture: Heal
Slann Starmaster (265)*
- Spell: Celestial Apotheosis
Terradon Chief (80)**
Celestant-Prime, Hammer of Sigmar (325)*
- Allies

Battleline
5 x Saurus Guard (115)*
Stegadon (265)***
- Weapon: Skystreak Bow
Stegadon (265)***
- Weapon: Skystreak Bow

Units
3 x Terradon Riders (105)**
- Starstrike Javelins

Behemoths
Bastiladon with Solar Engine (250)

Endless Spells & Invocations
Emerald Lifeswarm (60)

Core Battalions
*Warlord
**Vanguard
***Hunters of the Heartlands

Additional Enhancements
Artefact

Total: 1995 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 0 / 4
Allies: 325 / 400
Wounds: 81
Drops: 9

This list still keeps the core Thunder Lizard units of a Slann, Engine and Bastiladon, but sacrifices wound count and pure damage potential for a lot more mobility with the Terradons and Celestant Prime and more monsters for battle tactics, plus Stegadons can do some pretty decent damage. This list is more or less an excuse to play my Couatl Celestant Prime proxy (I'm pretty sure the TO is ok with it).

And finally:

Allegiance: Seraphon
- Constellation: Thunder Lizard
- Grand Strategy: Hold the Line
- Triumphs:

Leaders
Saurus Oldblood on Carnosaur (270)**
- General
- Command Trait: Prime Warbeast
- Artefact: Blade of Realities
- Mount Trait: Beastmaster
Slann Starmaster (265)*
- Artefact: Itxi Grubs
- Spell: Celestial Apotheosis
Skink Starseer (145)*
- Spell: Hand of Glory
Skink Starpriest (130)*
- Artefact: Fusil of Conflaguration
- Spell: Hand of Glory
Skink Priest (80)**
- Universal Prayer Scripture: Heal
Skink Priest (80)**
- Universal Prayer Scripture: Heal

Battleline
30 x Skinks (225)***
- Boltspitters Celestite Daggers & Star Bucklers
- Reinforced x 2
30 x Skinks (225)***
- Boltspitters Celestite Daggers & Star Bucklers
- Reinforced x 2
5 x Saurus Knights (110)***
- Lances
5 x Saurus Guard (115)**

Behemoths
Bastiladon with Solar Engine (250)

Endless Spells & Invocations
Emerald Lifeswarm (60)
Chronomantic Cogs (45)

Core Battalions
*Command Entourage - Magnificent
**Warlord
***Hunters of the Heartlands

Additional Enhancements
Artefact
Artefact

Total: 2000 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 4 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 126
Drops: 11

The idea behind this one is to just overload on Skink shooting, use the Knights more as screens for the Skinks and just buff the heck out of the Skinks with the heroes. Use the Slann for magic support, and the Oldblood wait until a target presents itself and attack. And once again, it's an excuse to use my favorite model in the game (along with Kroak), Kroq-Gar! (AKA, the Oldblood on Carnosaur). I'm thinking I could try swapping the Cogs and Lifeswarm for the Soulsnare Shackles and Prismatic Palisade or Burning Head.

 

[Gothurz]

Info to your first list: U can't use Thunderquake Battalion. U miss one unit for use it. U don't have 2 Basti, or 2stegs, or both 1basti and one steg.

 

[Kilvakar]

Info to your first list: U can't use Thunderquake Battalion. U miss one unit for use it. U don't have 2 Basti, or 2stegs, or both 1basti and one steg.

You're right! I think I had a Stegadon in there in the first draft and I forgot to change it after removing it! Thanks for catching that

 

[Schneelachs]

Hey Mate,

remember you can do just the same prayer once. Also you can do the command ability +1 to hit from the prists also only once per turn.

So this looks like a waste in list 3.

"Skink Priest (80)**
- Universal Prayer Scripture: Heal
Skink Priest (80)**
- Universal Prayer Scripture: Heal"

 

[chefofwar]

for going to any event, let alone your first event, pick whichever list you are most comfortable with and remember all the stuff the best with.

the biggest advice I can give is just have fun and dont get all twisted up inside. 99% of other tournament players are just like you. for the most part the entire field at an event is not some grizzled, veteran hardcore meta players. folks just playing the armies they think are cool.

realistically, also set your goals or expectations. this is all easier said than done, but i found any time I faced off against an army I had not played, it usually was a tough game. just part of learning.

micromanaging lists/points is only so much of the lead up. being confident with your rules, the roles of each unit, and an overall strategy you want to enact on the table is a big part of success. having a deployment plan, general attack plan, and idea in how you want the army to move and act is so important. dont second guess yourself, stick to your plan.

you will also be able to look back at any games and know that you gave yourself the best chance to win. I have kicked myself after a loss because I was using a new unit and forgot one of their rules. coulda shoulda woulda.

people go to events to have some good games. not club seals or piss in your cereal. think of them as just a big group of folks just like your casual games but timed.

 

[Kilvakar]

Thanks very much for the advice. I've been learning the rules for Seraphon for a while now, to the point where I feel like I'm pretty confident in the army. However, I'm noticing more and more how much they actually suffer in 3e with no rend and bad saves. I just got what I would have considered a pretty decent list absolutely slaughtered vs. a Stormcast list that just brought a bunch of named heroes and threw in 3 units of 10 Liberators to fill out battleline. I couldn't kill anything and got ground down pretty quickly once melee started. Kroak died to 6 damage from Bastian Carthalos' mortal wound lightning attack. When your opponent's army is sitting on 3+ saves even for their basic battleline, and most of their attacks have -1 or -2 rend, being able to double-shoot Bastiladons or deal mortal wounds with Kroak and Skinks doesn't really match up as well as it did in 3e.

I know that a lot of people still disagree with me, but I think that Seraphon are falling behind pretty quickly in 3e. We rely so heavily on stacking command abilities and our stats are so bad (yes, they are bad. This battle really sealed it for me.) that now that we can't more than maybe 2 buffs on a single unit anymore we just don't do enough damage to reliably get through armies with high saves and high rend.

Of course, I know that AoS encourages spammy play, so I might have done better with an all-dino list, or Salamander spam, etc. But I also don't want to be a "that guy" when it comes to games either, lol!

 

[Kilvakar]

After my recent butt-whooping by Stormcast, I realized how much Seraphon have to rely on mortal wounds to do any damage, with multiple armies that are able to sit at a 3+ save, our volume of attacks strategy doesn't work nearly as well as it used to. So I caved a bit and added Salamanders and the Celestant Prime ally to have a reliable damage-dealer that also has a 3+ save, and more access to mortal wounds. Here's what I'm leaning towards now:

Allegiance: Seraphon
- Constellation: Thunder Lizard
- Grand Strategy:
- Triumphs:

Leaders
Celestant-Prime, Hammer of Sigmar (325)*
- Allies
Engine of the Gods (265)**
- General
- Command Trait: Prime Warbeast
- Artefact: Cloak of Feathers
- Mount Trait: Beastmaster
- Universal Prayer Scripture: Curse
Slann Starmaster (265)*
- Spell: Celestial Apotheosis
Skink Starpriest (130)*
- Artefact: Fusil of Conflaguration
- Spell: Hand of Glory

Battleline
5 x Saurus Guard (115)*
10 x Skinks (75)
- Moonstone Clubs & Star bucklers
10 x Skinks (75)
- Moonstone Clubs & Star bucklers

Units
2 x Salamander Hunting Pack (280)**
- Reinforced x 1
3 x Kroxigor (150)*

Behemoths
Bastiladon with Solar Engine (250)**

Endless Spells & Invocations
Emerald Lifeswarm (60)

Core Battalions
*Warlord
**Thunderquake - Slayers

Additional Enhancements
Artefact

Total: 1990 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 1 / 4
Allies: 325 / 400
Wounds: 95
Drops: 10

 

[chefofwar]

my usual opponents play fyreslayers and nurgle. I have pretty much always brought a quicksilver sword spell as well.

you are right with the MW route

comets: D3
realm shaper D3
prime: D3
engine x2: x2 D3 (usually)
quicksilver swords
curse
30 skinks with poison

that is my current lists outsput

 

[Erta Wanderer]

go for a 3-2 and you should be fine with this list. love how you decided to bring krox

 

[Just A Skink]

After my recent butt-whooping by Stormcast, I realized how much Seraphon have to rely on mortal wounds to do any damage, with multiple armies that are able to sit at a 3+ save, our volume of attacks strategy doesn't work nearly as well as it used to. So I caved a bit and added Salamanders and the Celestant Prime ally to have a reliable damage-dealer that also has a 3+ save, and more access to mortal wounds. Here's what I'm leaning towards now:

Allegiance: Seraphon
- Constellation: Thunder Lizard
- Grand Strategy:
- Triumphs:

Leaders
Celestant-Prime, Hammer of Sigmar (325)*
- Allies
Engine of the Gods (265)**
- General
- Command Trait: Prime Warbeast
- Artefact: Cloak of Feathers
- Mount Trait: Beastmaster
- Universal Prayer Scripture: Curse
Slann Starmaster (265)*
- Spell: Celestial Apotheosis
Skink Starpriest (130)*
- Artefact: Fusil of Conflaguration
- Spell: Hand of Glory

Battleline
5 x Saurus Guard (115)*
10 x Skinks (75)
- Moonstone Clubs & Star bucklers
10 x Skinks (75)
- Moonstone Clubs & Star bucklers

Units
2 x Salamander Hunting Pack (280)**
- Reinforced x 1
3 x Kroxigor (150)*

Behemoths
Bastiladon with Solar Engine (250)**

Endless Spells & Invocations
Emerald Lifeswarm (60)

Core Battalions
*Warlord
**Thunderquake - Slayers

Additional Enhancements
Artefact

Total: 1990 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 1 / 4
Allies: 325 / 400
Wounds: 95
Drops: 10

Sorry to nitpick @Kilvakar, but I think you still need to have 2 Bastiladons/Stegadons in any combo for the Thunderquake battalion.

 

[Kilvakar]

Nope, you're right. I need to stop making lists at midnight, lol!

 

[Kilvakar]

Ok, so after looking things over once again, I'm torn between these two lists:

Kroq-Gar and the Thunderquake Host:

Allegiance: Seraphon
- Constellation: Thunder Lizard
- Grand Strategy: Beast Master
- Triumphs: Inspired

Leaders
Saurus Oldblood on Carnosaur (270)**
- General
- Command Trait: Prime Warbeast
- Artefact: Blade of Realities
- Mount Trait: Beastmaster
Slann Starmaster (265)**
- Spell: Celestial Apotheosis
Engine of the Gods (265)*
- Artefact: Fusil of Conflaguration
- Universal Prayer Scripture: Curse
Skink Priest (80)

Battleline
5 x Saurus Guard (115)**
Stegadon (265)**
- Weapon: Skystreak Bow
Stegadon (265)*
- Weapon: Skystreak Bow

Units
3 x Kroxigor (150)*

Behemoths
Bastiladon with Solar Engine (250)*

Endless Spells & Invocations
Emerald Lifeswarm (60)

Core Battalions
*Thunderquake - Slayers
**Warlord

Additional Enhancements
Artefact

Total: 1985 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 0 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 87
Drops: 9

Or a modification of my previous list idea:

Allegiance: Seraphon
- Constellation: Thunder Lizard
- Mortal Realm: Ghur
- Grand Strategy: Beast Master
- Triumphs:

Leaders
Celestant-Prime, Hammer of Sigmar (325)**
- Allies
Engine of the Gods (265)*
- General
- Command Trait: Prime Warbeast
- Artefact: Cloak of Feathers
- Mount Trait: Beastmaster
- Universal Prayer Scripture: Curse
Slann Starmaster (265)*
- Spell: Celestial Equilibrium
Skink Starpriest (130)*
- Artefact: Fusil of Conflaguration
- Spell: Hand of Glory

Battleline
5 x Saurus Guard (115)**
10 x Skinks (75)**
- Moonstone Clubs & Star bucklers
10 x Skinks (75)**
- Moonstone Clubs & Star bucklers

Units
2 x Salamander Hunting Pack (280)**
- Reinforced x 1
3 x Kroxigor (150)**

Behemoths
Bastiladon with Solar Engine (250)**

Endless Spells & Invocations
Emerald Lifeswarm (60)

Core Battalions
*Command Entourage - Magnificent
**Battle Regiment

Additional Enhancements
Artefact

Total: 1990 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 1 / 4
Allies: 325 / 400
Wounds: 95
Drops: 4

What do you guys think? It's definitely down to one of these two. If I bring the first one, I'm using the Oldblood because he can actually do more than 2 damage to a target, especially with the Blade of Realities vs. a hero. But this list relies on just shooting stuff as much as possible before going ham in melee with the Stegadons and Carnosaur.

The second list is shorter range but has more mortal wounds and the Prime to drop in in later turns to kill key targets or take the typically more valuable backline objectives. I think this list might be more vulnerable once stuff gets into melee, but more mortal wounds is always nice and I have that Coatl model I really want to use, lol! (TO approved my 3rd-party Kroxigors and Coatl counts-as-Prime models!)

 

[Kilvakar]

Well, it's official. I'm registered and locked in for May 1st! Here's the list I decided on bringing:

Allegiance: Seraphon
- Constellation: Thunder Lizard
- Grand Strategy: Beast Master
- Triumphs: Inspired

Leaders
Engine of the Gods (265)**
- General
- Command Trait: Prime Warbeast
- Artefact: Cloak of Feathers
- Mount Trait: Beastmaster
- Universal Prayer Scripture: Curse
Slann Starmaster (265)*
- Spell: Celestial Equilibrium
Skink Priest (80)*
- Universal Prayer Scripture: Heal
Skink Starpriest (130)*
- Artefact: Fusil of Conflaguration
- Spell: Hand of Glory

Battleline
5 x Saurus Guard (115)**
Stegadon (265)**
- Weapon: Skystreak Bow
Stegadon (265)**
- Weapon: Skystreak Bow

Units
6 x Kroxigor (300)**
- 2x Moonhammers
- Reinforced x 1

Behemoths
Bastiladon with Solar Engine (250)**

Endless Spells & Invocations
Emerald Lifeswarm (60)

Core Battalions
*Command Entourage - Magnificent
**Battle Regiment

Additional Enhancements
Artefact

Total: 1995 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 1 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 91
Drops: 4

Decided anything Saurus was just too weak to bring to my first tournament (except Guard, of course). But rather than rely on a single model like Kroak or the Celestant Prime to do most of my heavy lifting, I'm going to stick with the "hold back and shoot all your dinos into one target" strategy I've had good results with before. I'm going to stick with a pure castle build against most things. I don't know if I'll be facing Lumineth, Morathi or KO, which will probably shred this list but no list is good against everything

 

[Erta Wanderer]

Well, it's official. I'm registered and locked in for May 1st! Here's the list I decided on bringing:

Allegiance: Seraphon
- Constellation: Thunder Lizard
- Grand Strategy: Beast Master
- Triumphs: Inspired

Leaders
Engine of the Gods (265)**
- General
- Command Trait: Prime Warbeast
- Artefact: Cloak of Feathers
- Mount Trait: Beastmaster
- Universal Prayer Scripture: Curse
Slann Starmaster (265)*
- Spell: Celestial Equilibrium
Skink Priest (80)*
- Universal Prayer Scripture: Heal
Skink Starpriest (130)*
- Artefact: Fusil of Conflaguration
- Spell: Hand of Glory

Battleline
5 x Saurus Guard (115)**
Stegadon (265)**
- Weapon: Skystreak Bow
Stegadon (265)**
- Weapon: Skystreak Bow

Units
6 x Kroxigor (300)**
- 2x Moonhammers
- Reinforced x 1

Behemoths
Bastiladon with Solar Engine (250)**

Endless Spells & Invocations
Emerald Lifeswarm (60)

Core Battalions
*Command Entourage - Magnificent
**Battle Regiment

Additional Enhancements
Artefact

Total: 1995 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 1 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 91
Drops: 4

Decided anything Saurus was just too weak to bring to my first tournament (except Guard, of course). But rather than rely on a single model like Kroak or the Celestant Prime to do most of my heavy lifting, I'm going to stick with the "hold back and shoot all your dinos into one target" strategy I've had good results with before. I'm going to stick with a pure castle build against most things. I don't know if I'll be facing Lumineth, Morathi or KO, which will probably shred this list but no list is good against everything

be sure to get a few games in to practice the list.

 

[Putzfrau]

Well, it's official. I'm registered and locked in for May 1st! Here's the list I decided on bringing:

Allegiance: Seraphon
- Constellation: Thunder Lizard
- Grand Strategy: Beast Master
- Triumphs: Inspired

Leaders
Engine of the Gods (265)**
- General
- Command Trait: Prime Warbeast
- Artefact: Cloak of Feathers
- Mount Trait: Beastmaster
- Universal Prayer Scripture: Curse
Slann Starmaster (265)*
- Spell: Celestial Equilibrium
Skink Priest (80)*
- Universal Prayer Scripture: Heal
Skink Starpriest (130)*
- Artefact: Fusil of Conflaguration
- Spell: Hand of Glory

Battleline
5 x Saurus Guard (115)**
Stegadon (265)**
- Weapon: Skystreak Bow
Stegadon (265)**
- Weapon: Skystreak Bow

Units
6 x Kroxigor (300)**
- 2x Moonhammers
- Reinforced x 1

Behemoths
Bastiladon with Solar Engine (250)**

Endless Spells & Invocations
Emerald Lifeswarm (60)

Core Battalions
*Command Entourage - Magnificent
**Battle Regiment

Additional Enhancements
Artefact

Total: 1995 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 1 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 91
Drops: 4

Decided anything Saurus was just too weak to bring to my first tournament (except Guard, of course). But rather than rely on a single model like Kroak or the Celestant Prime to do most of my heavy lifting, I'm going to stick with the "hold back and shoot all your dinos into one target" strategy I've had good results with before. I'm going to stick with a pure castle build against most things. I don't know if I'll be facing Lumineth, Morathi or KO, which will probably shred this list but no list is good against everything

Love it. Good luck, tournaments are amazing go for the social experience and the games are just a bonus.

Go in with no expectations other than to have a good time and you'll do exactly that

Also like the list, don't be afraid to be patient stegs play the long game really well!

 

[Kilvakar]

be sure to get a few games in to practice the list.

Will do! I'll probably be on TTS several times this week, lol!

Love it. Good luck, tournaments are amazing go for the social experience and the games are just a bonus.

Go in with no expectations other than to have a good time and you'll do exactly that

Also like the list, don't be afraid to be patient stegs play the long game really well!

Thanks! That's the attitude I'm going in with for sure. And you're right, I plan to mostly sit back and let the enemy move toward me while I shoot as much as possible. I'm nervous but looking forward to it!

 

[Tombomb7]

Great reading this thread and I wish you the best of luck with your event! Be sure to come back and let us know how it went

 

[Kilvakar]

Welp, It's done! The tournament was fun, I didn't do too well but I kind of expected that. I made a thread about it in the battle report section!

But the TLDR version is that I won vs. a non-competitive Seraphon list, lost to a mostly competitive Kruleboyz list but would have won if the game wasn't on a timer, and lost to a very meta Ironjawz list that just did what IJ do and crapped all over me turn 1.

Lesson learned: If your event is on a timer, don't bring a castle army that relies on catching up on VP later in the game....

 

[Erta Wanderer]

Welp, It's done! The tournament was fun, I didn't do too well but I kind of expected that. I made a thread about it in the battle report section!

But the TLDR version is that I won vs. a non-competitive Seraphon list, lost to a mostly competitive Kruleboyz list but would have won if the game wasn't on a timer, and lost to a very meta Ironjawz list that just did what IJ do and crapped all over me turn 1.

Lesson learned: If your event is on a timer, don't bring a castle army that relies on catching up on VP later in the game....

eh only half true. i play castle heavy armies it takes very tight play though. that and you have to punish slow play from your opponent.


only 3 rounds? thats odd most are 5

 

[Kilvakar]

There wasn't a limit on the rounds, but an actual time limit of 3 hours per game. "chess clock rules," they called it. I haven't gotten good enough to just rip through everything that fast, lol! I still take an average of 4 hours per game with my friends/family who play, and we usually end up calling it by turn 4...