8th Ed. The Trog-list that worked

[Mr Phat]

Hey fellas.
I posted this at VampTeddys Trog-thread earlier but thought I'd like it in a seperate threat for an elaborate discussion of it.

The "repost"

It comes at 2400pts on the mark and fits ETC restrictions.

Lords

Slann Mage-Priest
- Dispel Scroll
- Ironcurse Icon
- Wandering Deliberations
- Battle standard - Skavenpelt Banner


Core


10x Skink Skirmisher
-Javelin and Shield

10x Skink Skirmisher
-Javelin and Shield

10x Skink Skirmisher
-javelin and Shield

10x Skink Skirmisher
-Javelin and Shield

18x Skink , Musician
20x Skink , Musician
20x Skink ,Musician

Special

7x Kroxigor

7x Kroxigor

30x Temple Guard
- Musician
- Revered Guardian
- Standard Bearer

Rare

Troglodon


WHAT IS THIS?!?!!?!?
No Salamanders? a Trog instead of a Steg?!......NO SCAR VETS!??!
HERESY!

shhh shhh shhhhh *pats on head*, its gonna be o...kay!


DEPLOYMENT
The Slann obviously goes with the TG (horde), with a krox unit on each flank.
The skinks gets placed as flank and middle redirectors.
Trog goes on whatever flank that most likely will need the occasional magic missile (keep him within 12'')

TACTIC
Pure lawnmower: pick a target for your TG, let the krox hinge on and follow until they get in charge range of something juicy.
Skinks swarm the way they usually do...so heres the shiny part:

THE TROGS JOBS

1. Keep him (given its a male) close enough for his Roar to work on TG and krox, but only use it for the TG's sake, Krox are bonus not primary.

2. His shooting attack Supports the skinks on the flank. After yesterdays game I no longer neglect this.
Its not a game winner, but he DOES hit ..remember its 4+ if you are within 9'' of the enemy unit.
And at S5 with poison, it can actually put a little extra hurt on whatever armoured unit the skinks are cushioning
(cushioning: The act of filling something with needles, darts, javelins and other sharp pointy objects)

3. Your Slann is looking the other way because of his TG's heavy combat-itch. Trog serves as eyes on whatever target the slann is not able to point at, and since you picked WD you got tons of neat magic missiles, where two in particular ALSO works well for dealing with messy flankjobs:

Searing for those armoured fools
Leech for that monster outside his Generals bubble.

4. Speaking of generals bubble: you have a flank unit monster who causes terror. Re-mem-ber .....this.

MAGIC
roll Earthblood every turn to buff your frenzied killing block and heal a wound on a Kroxigor (there will be one)

Wyssans: This will probably go on your TG everytime. If you cast it for defensive power on krox it is my point of view that you are wasting dice, as Iceshard is cheaper, is valid no matter the strength of the attacker and works well with the fact that Krox cause fear (RE-MEM-BER...)
so
Iceshard: used for combat (..THIS!) or for saving your units from ranged attacks.

Miasma: use it to even WS, lower M (for pursuit) equally to save your CC army from ranged attacks.

The other 4 is magic missiles that speaks for themselves, and oh boy do they work well with the Troglodon, here credited with its full name.

Honestly, the options he grant is well worth his 200pts. While I truthfully believes this it still feels like an overprice do to him being a rare choice and do to his survive-ability.
I believe his place either should be in Special, or be granted the option of the Oracle carrying some protective upgrades or items.....those thoughts aside, looking at what we have, I must take everything bad back Ive ever said of the Trog, and go back to my original view
(http://www.lustria-online.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=12344)

He is awesome if you dont make the mistake of trying to get him to do a Steg or carnos job. Thats not what he does.

He IS your Slanns priceless extra set of eyes, he IS the big guy behind the cocky skink
and
he IS the guy who combined with the Skavenpelt banner makes your Templeguard able to overpower even
white-lions......

Try it or not. Keep using your Skink Priests if you wish, im gonna go pick up a box of pale death as soon as my poor unemployed self gets the cash for it

 

[GCPD]

Great list! Battle reports please

What would you say to the argument that a Skink Priest and bumping both Kroxigor to 8 would have a greater effective? Or slipping in a Vet?

How has it faired against cannons?

 

[Mr Phat]

I havnt tried it against cannons yet, and so far it only has one battle under its belt, but both me and the HE player agreed that it was a VERY interesting list and that he was in doubt on how to deal with it.

cant remember the battle detailed enough for , will probably make a report of the next time (I think I found my list )

adressing the skink issue...I might agree that it could do things, yet I feel like I need to try Trog more times to make sure im pushing him to what he can do, as I still think I got stuff to learn! (second game with him ever)
For instance I didnt use his Terror properly, as it is more usable on flanks/outside the LD/BSB bubble.
His spit is very useful! a skink cant do this, as well as a skink cant take on tougher flank units.
Dont forget that Trog aint BAD in fights, his just not stegadon good
use him accordingly and he will perform well for his buck.

Yes I miss my coldboys (which would be my name for scar-vets), yes the krox could need another body in each unit, it actually makes a bigger difference than one can imagine, and yes I might end up finding that the priest does the job
...but under all given circumstances: I think I discovered what Vetock was thinking when he designed it, and have to do more field research on the subject to make final conclusions

 

[Mr Phat]

sidenote: im considering bringing two blocks of saurus instead of skinks...just to see if this would have any form of competitiveness

 

[GCPD]

Thing is, with a WD Slann you can drop Iceshard on a cannon, so there is a chance that your Trog doesn't get taken off turn 1.

My other major concern would be Purple Sun: all though expesive I1 and I2 units...

 

[Mr Phat]

Purple Sun and Pit will always be "one of those things". I hope they change them in 9ed..they are so massively OP.

You cant cover everything, but it might even be another reason to add a skink priest for +1 iceshard and to carry that cube.

 

[Pinktaco]

Purple Sun and Pit will always be "one of those things". I hope they change them in 9ed..they are so massively OP.

You cant cover everything, but it might even be another reason to add a skink priest for +1 iceshard and to carry that cube.

I would've hoped for that myself, but just look at our own very own book. Isn't Fiery Convocation even worse since it's a Remains in Play spell? I would be weird to nerf the other unit destroyer spells and leave out high magic lol.
But maybe they'll change how dispelling works so you can't IF spells the same way?

Anyway as I wrote in the other thread I'll actually be getting a troglodon next months, the issue is that I'll be up against a dwarf player <.<

 

[GCPD]

I would've hoped for that myself, but just look at our own very own book. Isn't Fiery Convocation even worse since it's a Remains in Play spell?

No. Purple Sun is significantly worse than Fiery Convocation, which is only a threat to something that's T3 or worse (which doesn't tend to be that much threatening), and which can only take out one unit at a time. Whilst one IF Purple Sun can take off half your army, especially if that army happens to be cursed with low Initiative (because, you know, otherwise Saurus heavy lists would be OP, right?). But its equally good against average-Initiative armies, who might dodge 50% of the damage but will probably have more models, and the lore attribute even makes it worthwhile against high-Initiative armies.

 

[Ondjage]

Major thing about Psun and similar spells is that they don't allow ward saves, rendering magic resistance, ward saves, scroll of shielding and such useless.. And that is nonsense!

 

[Mr Phat]

Major thing about Psun and similar spells is that they don't allow ward saves, rendering magic resistance, ward saves, scroll of shielding and such useless.. And that is nonsense!

I play ETC where a lookout sir is given to a max of 2 characters per unit, so that at least is something.

 

[Pinktaco]

I would've hoped for that myself, but just look at our own very own book. Isn't Fiery Convocation even worse since it's a Remains in Play spell?

No. Purple Sun is significantly worse than Fiery Convocation, which is only a threat to something that's T3 or worse (which doesn't tend to be that much threatening), and which can only take out one unit at a time. Whilst one IF Purple Sun can take off half your army, especially if that army happens to be cursed with low Initiative (because, you know, otherwise Saurus heavy lists would be OP, right?). But its equally good against average-Initiative armies, who might dodge 50% of the damage but will probably have more models, and the lore attribute even makes it worthwhile against high-Initiative armies.

Yeah, well alright there's a difference, but let's also be honest, all of those spells (including Fiery C) can be quite devastating. I just doubt that we'd be given this spell and nerf all the other "uber" spells. Just my opinion though.