8th Ed. Skrox ranking

[Gor-rok]

If you cast Regrowth on that unit and Skinks came back to life, would that
(NOPE AFTER ALL THE SKINKS ARE DEAD IT BECOMES A KROXIGOR UNIT)

BUT THIS IS POSSIBLE IF ONLY A FEW SKINKS ARE LEFT:

Rank 1 KKKKSS<---
Rank 2 KKKKKK

I can't find any entry in the rules that supports this conclusion.

It's still a Skink Cohort; there's no reason why the unit type would change. You bought them as a Skink Cohort, possibly with command, and the points were counted as core. Regrowth spells out very clearly how to go about resurrecting them: First champion, then musician (which in this case will be skinks), then any multi-wound models are restored to full (kroxigor), then other rank and file models (all the other skinks). Follow the mixed unit rules under the cohort entry as you add the models back.

 

[Screamer]

Sorry to derail but how would tenhehauin be placed in a skrox unit? In the front rank(displacing the kroxigor behind him)? Can that kroxigor attack? Or would the 2nd rank Kroc take precedence and tenhehauin be placed behind the krox?

The kroxigor behind him could attack if your unit was in horde formation. It is in the 3rd rank, and whether or not a unit can attack is determined by what rank it is in, not whether or not it is in b2b with a model in combat.

The krox behind tehehauin can attack w 3 supporting attacks. The rule says something like "models can make supporting attacks if they're in base contact with a model that is in base contact with a enemy to the front"

 

[n810]

If you cast Regrowth on that unit and Skinks came back to life, would that
(NOPE AFTER ALL THE SKINKS ARE DEAD IT BECOMES A KROXIGOR UNIT)

BUT THIS IS POSSIBLE IF ONLY A FEW SKINKS ARE LEFT:

Rank 1 KKKKSS<---
Rank 2 KKKKKK

I can't find any entry in the rules that supports this conclusion.

It's still a Skink Cohort; there's no reason why the unit type would change. You bought them as a Skink Cohort, possibly with command, and the points were counted as core. Regrowth spells out very clearly how to go about resurrecting them: First champion, then musician (which in this case will be skinks), then any multi-wound models are restored to full (kroxigor), then other rank and file models (all the other skinks). Follow the mixed unit rules under the cohort entry as you add the models back.

I think it was in the previous FAQ...

 

[Sleboda]

Further proof that old FAQs are 100% meaningless when the rules they were for are replaced.

 

[n810]

What relevant rules are different ?

 

[hdctambien]

I think it was in the previous FAQ...

Further proof that old FAQs are 100% meaningless when the rules they were for are replaced

Maybe it was in a really old FAQ, but nothing like that is in the previous FAQ.

I'm not sure everything in the previous FAQ is meaningless, and if there was a new FAQ I would expect it to (eventually) answer some of the same questions:


Q. Can Barbed Razordons choose to flee from a second or subsequent charge after it has used its stand and shoot charge reaction? (p57)

Q. If a Stegadon is taken as a mount can the character’s BS be used when firing the howdah weapons? (p55)


Since there is no FAQ any more, what are the answers to these questions? Are they no longer settled or should the old book interpretations be used as a fall back until a new FAQ is released?

 

[n810]

Hmmm maybe it was in the main 8th BRB FAQ... ?

Ps. heres and old conversations about the same topic... http://www.tekbot.com/warhammer/index.php?topic=2423.0

 

[Tecuani]

I think it was in the previous FAQ...

Further proof that old FAQs are 100% meaningless when the rules they were for are replaced

Maybe it was in a really old FAQ, but nothing like that is in the previous FAQ.

I'm not sure everything in the previous FAQ is meaningless, and if there was a new FAQ I would expect it to (eventually) answer some of the same questions:


Q. Can Barbed Razordons choose to flee from a second or subsequent charge after it has used its stand and shoot charge reaction? (p57)

Q. If a Stegadon is taken as a mount can the character’s BS be used when firing the howdah weapons? (p55)


Since there is no FAQ any more, what are the answers to these questions? Are they no longer settled or should the old book interpretations be used as a fall back until a new FAQ is released?

In the case of razordons, the restriction that they must stand and shoot explicitly applies only if they are able to, so there is absolutely no reason why they shouldn't be able to flee from a subsequent charge. They're unable to stand and shoot in that situation, so their special rule doesn't apply.

 

[hdctambien]

In the case of razordons, the restriction that they must stand and shoot explicitly applies only if they are able to, so there is absolutely no reason why they shouldn't be able to flee from a subsequent charge. They're unable to stand and shoot in that situation, so their special rule doesn't apply.

The wording of the old book, which the FAQ addresses is: "Barbed Razordons must stand and shoot if they are able to do so."
The wording of the new book is: "If charged, a Razordon Hunting Pack must stand and shoot if it is able to do so"

Seems to me that the wording is exactly the same, and the last time GW addressed the question they said that the Razordon could NOT flee from the second charge.

The only difference now is that the FAQ doesn't exist. But does that mean the ruling is reversed?

The old FAQ read:

Q. Can Barbed Razordonschoose to flee from a second or
subsequent charge after it has used its stand and shoot charge
reaction? (p57)
A. No.

 

[Tecuani]

Even that faq was ambiguous-it also ruled that razordons could flee when unable to stand and shoot. The only difference between the two questions is the presence of an example. More relevantly, neither answer is current, and rather than second guessing whether a new faq would have the same answer, it's surely better to go by the rules as they are written in the army book, which are not ambiguous. "...if it is able to do so." is a clear limit on when they are restricted.

 

[Sleboda]

Since there is no FAQ any more, what are the answers to these questions? Are they no longer settled or should the old book interpretations be used as a fall back until a new FAQ is released?

=> They are no longer settled.

 

[hdctambien]

Even that faq was ambiguous-it also ruled that razordons could flee when unable to stand and shoot. The only difference between the two questions is the presence of an example

The other FAQ was:

Q. Can Barbed Razordons choose to flee if charged by an enemy
that is close enough to negate the stand and shoot charge reaction?
(p57)
A. Yes.

I don't think those two FAQ's contradict each other.

it's surely better to go by the rules as they are written in the army book, which are not ambiguous. "...if it is able to do so." is a clear limit on when they are restricted.

The rule is written the exact same way in the new book as it was in the old book and GW said that your interpretation is incorrect. What is different that makes you say that the exact same words in the exact same order ("must stand and shoot if they are able to") under the exact same BRB suddenly mean something different than they did 6 months ago?

Clearly someone asked this question in the past so the interpretation that there is "a clear limit on when they are restricted" is not universally accepted.

This wasn't an errata, it was just a regular answer to a frequently asked question.

What is up to interpretation is what does it mean to "be able to stand and shoot". The FAQ implied that being able to stand and shoot required are described on BRB Page 17:

- The chargee must have a shooting attack
- The range to the charger is greater than the charging unit's Move characteristic

To allow the Razordon to be able to flee from the 2nd charge means that additionally BRB Page 18 "There's Too Many Of Them" comes into play:

- The chargee has not stood and shot already this turn

The precedence is that GW did not consider the "There's Too Many of Them" a condition for the ability of a unit to stand and shoot.

 

[Gor-rok]

Anything in the previous FAQ counts just as much as rules from our old book- That is, not at all. It's answering questions that apply to an old and invalid rule set, making it just as invalid. If you want to use it as the basis for a house ruling, go for it, but it'd have to be agreed on by your opponent; It's not like the U.S. legal system, where earlier rulings set precedence and can be enforced.

It's why Tyranid players are jumping at the chance to take emplaced weapons now- the FAQ saying they couldn't fire them ceased to exist. Until we get an official FAQ to go along with our current book, the myriad ambiguities in it are going to have to stay unsettled.