Tutorial Saurus Warriors.. The tactica?!

[Bainbow]

I just need to get off plague of rust off once for it to work. If I'm not allowed to get spells off neither is my opponent. The thing about plague PF rust is that it's permanent. Besides arguing that Light >Metal and then arguing Dispels > me is kinda silly? Why should metal be any more dispelled than light? Besides I still got other spells from heaven most people would priorities.
Just to be clear I am aware that I can't guarantee that spells go off neither can my opponent. I'm not basing my army directly on magic - if you look at my strategy concerning the dragon lord/terrorgheist no magic was involved.

Also do be aware that I have tetto'eko. He might screw me over 1/6 magic phase, but those other phases I'll be off with a very good (unless I IF) buff and thus be able to potentially get more spells off ^^

And just to be clear - I don't want to come off as arrogant or unwilling to listen. I'm very must listening to everything you guys say. I take it all with me and will eventually try it all out.

My point is that usually a person has the opportunity to nearly certainly dispel one spell of their choice. The only other notably useful spell for combat after that is Enchanted Blades, and if you're going up against a low or no armour enemy like Undead, Daemons, Slayers, or any Light Infantry army then Enchanted Blades is all you really have and that can be stopped by focusing dispelling on it. Because you brought up Lore of Light just there, let me compare it. That has Speed of Light which will certainly give the enemy a -1 To Hit due to the now increased WS as well as removing any ASF rerolls and giving you +1 To Hit as well as making the Pit of Shades and other Initiative Test killers worthless where they would have been fatal on our I1 infantry, plus the spell is easy to bubble cast, Pha's Protection which gives a valuable -1 To Hit which stacks with other -1's from other things like Twtto's Iceshard Blizzard and is easy to bubble cast as well as giving a 50/50 chance of totally blocking non-BS shooting attacks like the Terrorgheist screams or cannons, Birona's Timewarp which gives an extra attack which is valuable for aggressive tactics and ASF to remove any ASF rerolls and if you can get Speed of Light off too then you get the rerolls which is insane on Saurus, and against low strength enemies the Net of Amnytok can mess up a careful strategy for your opponent and do some light damage on top of that. If your enemy dispels one of your valuable buffs here, you have more that you can use. This also gives you more adaptability and unpredictability which plays to your favour.

 

[Haemoglobin]

Most VC players using a zombie dragon try to fit in a couple of units with champs for that reason. I know I run with 2-3 wolf units with a champ and 2 units of fliers with a champ to charge in and hopefully get an extra turn of smashing R&F.

And he will probably just 6dice the bound spell book (reroll to hit). Not entirely sure how the miscast happens on a book like that though. Does it get destroyed?

 

[Bainbow]

Also do be aware that I have tetto'eko. He might screw me over 1/6 magic phase, but those other phases I'll be off with a very good (unless I IF) buff and thus be able to potentially get more spells off ^^

Oh and remember that if you reroll 6's, that just means that you can pump max dice into important spells with a massively reduced risk of miscasting so even that's useful.

Most VC players using a zombie dragon try to fit in a couple of units with champs for that reason. I know I run with 2-3 wolf units with a champ and 2 units of fliers with a champ to charge in and hopefully get an extra turn of smashing R&F.

And he will probably just 6dice the bound spell book (reroll to hit). Not entirely sure how the miscast happens on a book like that though. Does it get destroyed?

If it's an innate spell then it becomes irresistible with no negative effects.

 

[Pinktaco]

My point is that usually a person has the opportunity to nearly certainly dispel one spell of their choice. The only other notably useful spell for combat after that is Enchanted Blades, and if you're going up against a low or no armour enemy like Undead, Daemons, Slayers, or any Light Infantry army then Enchanted Blades is all you really have and that can be stopped by focusing dispelling on it. Because you brought up Lore of Light just there, let me compare it. That has Speed of Light which will certainly give the enemy a -1 To Hit due to the now increased WS as well as removing any ASF rerolls and giving you +1 To Hit as well as making the Pit of Shades and other Initiative Test killers worthless where they would have been fatal on our I1 infantry, plus the spell is easy to bubble cast, Pha's Protection which gives a valuable -1 To Hit which stacks with other -1's from other things like Twtto's Iceshard Blizzard and is easy to bubble cast as well as giving a 50/50 chance of totally blocking non-BS shooting attacks like the Terrorgheist screams or cannons, Birona's Timewarp which gives an extra attack which is valuable for aggressive tactics and ASF to remove any ASF rerolls and if you can get Speed of Light off too then you get the rerolls which is insane on Saurus, and against low strength enemies the Net of Amnytok can mess up a careful strategy for your opponent and do some light damage on top of that. If your enemy dispels one of your valuable buffs here, you have more that you can use. This also gives you more adaptability and unpredictability which plays to your favour.

You are forgetting lore of heaven loremaster. I have iceshard blizzard, rerolling all 1s buff and rerolling all 6s hex. In total i have 6 buffs/augments. Don't discount lore of heaven just because they might not be as good as light rerolling all 1s is very good in both To Hit AND To Wound. And o think it works for armour saves as well?

 

[Haemoglobin]

Its an enchanted item if im not mistaken. I'd look it up but havent got any books on me atm.

 

[Pinktaco]

Most VC players using a zombie dragon try to fit in a couple of units with champs for that reason. I know I run with 2-3 wolf units with a champ and 2 units of fliers with a champ to charge in and hopefully get an extra turn of smashing R&F.

And he will probably just 6dice the bound spell book (reroll to hit). Not entirely sure how the miscast happens on a book like that though. Does it get destroyed?

I saw his listm don't consider this super pro players. He had 2 hordes (yes HORDES), of skellies, 1 unit of zombies, a single small unit of dogs and a single unit of spirit hosts.

Bound items get destroyed due to IF.

 

[Bainbow]

You are forgetting lore of heaven loremaster. I have iceshard blizzard, rerolling all 1s buff and rerolling all 6s hex. In total i have 6 buffs/augments. Don't discount lore of heaven just because they might not be as good as light rerolling all 1s is very good in both To Hit AND To Wound. And o think it works for armour saves as well?

Oh yeah it's good, but Tetto is a lower level wizard remember and you said yourself that it's not as good. In fact, Heavens and Light mesh brilliantly because with the both of them it's easy to get your opponents to be hitting on 6's.

 

[Pinktaco]

Its an enchanted item if im not mistaken. I'd look it up but havent got any books on me atm.

Yeh those times just get destroyed. It's stuff like the Solardon beam that have absolutely no risk of getting off an IF. The book will perish.

 

[Pinktaco]

Oh yeah it's good, but Tetto is a lower level wizard remember and you said yourself that it's not as good. In fact, Heavens and Light mesh brilliantly because with the both of them it's easy to get your opponents to be hitting on 6's.

It's Lvl 2 vs Lvl 2 but with tetto'eko being superior sue to his special rule. Not a guruateed succes, but the argument was that I only had a couple of hexes/augments and that's false. I have plenty and unless winds of magic flop I'll likely get *something* off lol. The question is What? <.<

**EDIT** do keep in mind that due to the dragon lord he'll be low on magic. He even said so himself when I met him at the store.

 

[Haemoglobin]

Ah okay. Well if I play with a Zombie Dragon I usually go all out on speed. Dual Terrorgheist, 2x 4 Vargheist+champ and some hexwraith. Fill core with wolf packs and 2 blocks of zombies/skellies to be a pain in the ass. Just make sure to keep the OB in a unit, having 2 of those Terrorgheists screaming at it will kill it eventually. Not sure if it can be screamed at while in a challenge though (imagine solo OB vs Zombie Dragon Lord, Terrorgheist screaming into that combat).

 

[Pinktaco]

My fingers are tired. I answered all your great posts on my phone xD

 

[Bainbow]

It's Lvl 2 vs Lvl 2 but with tetto'eko being superior sue to his special rule. Not a guruateed succes, but the argument was that I only had a couple of hexes/augments and that's false. I have plenty and unless winds of magic flop I'll likely get *something* off lol. The question is What? <.<

**EDIT** do keep in mind that due to the dragon lord he'll be low on magic. He even said so himself when I met him at the store.

And for the WoC? They won't be so forgiving, +1 To Hit AP and Iceshard won't slow them down.

 

[Pinktaco]

Ah okay. Well if I play with a Zombie Dragon I usually go all out on speed. Dual Terrorgheist, 2x 4 Vargheist+champ and some hexwraith. Fill core with wolf packs and 2 blocks of zombies/skellies to be a pain in the ass. Just make sure to keep the OB in a unit, having 2 of those Terrorgheists screaming at it will kill it eventually. Not sure if it can be screamed at while in a challenge though (imagine solo OB vs Zombie Dragon Lord, Terrorgheist screaming into that combat).

It should be able to scream into combat. Good thought. I'll have to deal with terrogheists asap to not risk that.

 

[Bainbow]

You said that the WoC player will aim for Purple Sun. That's death incarnate to Saurus unless you can, I dunno, somehow boost their Initiative to 10 ...

 

[Pinktaco]

And for the WoC? They won't be so forgiving, +1 To Hit AP and Iceshard won't slow them down.

In all honesty - There'll always be bad matchups. WoC will be bad regardless of what I do. I could pick Light and they'd still give me the middle finger. What good will WS10/I10 do against 1+ skullcrushers? They'll still do ridiculous amount of wounds and take none. In fact +1 To Hit and AP -> WS10 against skullcrushers.
The saving grace from Lore of Light appear to be the improved Shem's against the deamon prince.

Also why wouldn't lore of metal suddenly not be good against WoC? Didn't some of you just claim that WoC was one of the few armies it would actually be useful for?

 

[Pinktaco]

You said that the WoC player will aim for Purple Sun. That's death incarnate to Saurus unless you can, I dunno, somehow boost their Initiative to 10 ...

No I said DoC, but it's true that purple sun will fvck me over regardless, but now we're arguing that I need to get off I10 spell on one unit to stay alive. In other word that would be completely relying on magic to win. That's NOT what I've argued at all so far ^^

 

[Bainbow]

No I said DoC, but it's true that purple sun will fvck me over regardless, but now we're arguing that I need to get off I10 spell on one unit to stay alive. In other word that would be completely relying on magic to win. That's NOT what I've argued at all so far ^^

It's not relying on magic to win, but it is bringing as many covers and trump cards as you can so when one fails you have another. And if it's Daemons then Light works even better, Banishment can do some damage to smaller units.

In all honesty - There'll always be bad matchups. WoC will be bad regardless of what I do. I could pick Light and they'd still give me the middle finger. What good will WS10/I10 do against 1+ skullcrushers? They'll still do ridiculous amount of wounds and take none. In fact +1 To Hit and AP -> WS10 against skullcrushers.
The saving grace from Lore of Light appear to be the improved Shem's against the deamon prince.

Also why wouldn't lore of metal suddenly not be good against WoC? Didn't some of you just claim that WoC was one of the few armies it would actually be useful for?

On Temple Guard, a lot. Makes hitting easier for you and harder for them, there's the natural -2 to armour, Birona's gives more attacks to slip through the armour, then there's things like Pha's to make it harder still for them to hit, combine it with Iceshard to make it even harder, you're looking at an easy win via combat res.

 

[Pinktaco]

It's not relying on magic to win, but it is bringing as many covers and trump cards as you can so when one fails you have another. And if it's Daemons then Light works even better, Banishment can do some damage to smaller units.


On Temple Guard, a lot. Makes hitting easier for you and harder for them, there's the natural -2 to armour, Birona's gives more attacks to slip through the armour, then there's things like Pha's to make it harder still for them to hit, combine it with Iceshard to make it even harder, you're looking at an easy win via combat res.

Good points and that's why I'll try out both eventually ^^ Do mind that I never argued metal -> light. Just that I want to experiment and find my own way. With metal I feel that saurus warriors become much much better in many circumstances. The same can be said with light

 

[Pinktaco]

Ugh.. Now I just want to try out Lore of Light some more. Tetto'Eko really allow for some more diversive usage of the Slann. I'll have to try them out before the tourney ^^

 

[Bainbow]

Good points and that's why I'll try out both eventually ^^ Do mind that I never argued metal -> light. Just that I want to experiment and find my own way. With metal I feel that saurus warriors become much much better in many circumstances. The same can be said with light

Oh I should really stress that it's fine for you to go with Lore of Metal and experimentation is always good, dare I say it's almost necessary. At this point I'm just debating for the sake of sharing ideas rather than telling you what to do.