AoS Saurus warriors, Spears or clubs?

[Putzfrau]

Perhaps i'm being overly hopeful, but i feel like with a little sliding you could get more. Also, you don't need a tzaangar literally directly "in the gap" for that second row to still be within an inch.

Regardless, it does seem like there's something to be said that even in this ideal scenario for spears, they still average out to the same wounds. I feel like there would more more situations where clubs could squeeze in more attacks than spears, but that might just be me.

I think a statement like "spears are more reliable in larger groups" needs to have a little more rigor done to really back it up and get to the bottom of "ideal efficiency" but it doesn't seem like there's a huge difference either way.

I do agree, the difference isn't likely noticeable in most situations would why i tend to lean towards clubs. I feel like it forces me into better habits, which ends up working out well for jaw attacks (which often get a bump in the saurus-heavy battaltions).

 

[Canas]

Perhaps i'm being overly hopeful, but i feel like with a little sliding you could get more. Also, you don't need a tzaangar literally directly "in the gap" for that second row to still be within an inch.

Regardless, it does seem like there's something to be said that even in this ideal scenario for spears, they still average out to the same wounds. I feel like there would more more situations where clubs could squeeze in more attacks than spears, but that might just be me.

I think a statement like "spears are more reliable in larger groups" needs to have a little more rigor done to really back it up and get to the bottom of "ideal efficiency" but it doesn't seem like there's a huge difference either way.

I do agree, the difference isn't likely noticeable in most situations would why i tend to lean towards clubs. I feel like it forces me into better habits, which ends up working out well for jaw attacks (which often get a bump in the saurus-heavy battaltions).

I think that you won't really get a much more rigorous proof for "spears are more reliable in larger groups" simply on account of the proof's all being done in "lab-conditions". The moment your opponent places his stuff a bit fiddly, or you get into an argument wether something is actually 1.01" or 0.99" it'l go haywire. Not to mention the mess you get once more than 1 enemy is involved.

The only thing I can think of to make it more rigorous is just playing a bunch of games and looking at the amount of proper hits you score with each setup. Though even that is iffy.

Mostly I'd just say stick with your preference it won't matter much. Spears are going to be slightly better in large groups & can occasionally manage a 3th rank. Plus they''l be more reliable when the fights get messy and multiple units are involved. Clubs will be better for smaller units as they just have flat out better stats. The difference however will probably be like 1-2 hits over the course of entire game which really isn't worth the worry.

 

[ILKAIN]

In those photos you are not base to base with your (yellow/banner) models. if you actually move them up to true base to base, they get to attack. I appreciate the effort to substantiate your opinon.... you have no idea how many times people just say something then never back it up.. but in this case you are not actually moving your units into the appropriate spots to maximize the attacks. in a game this would be a a failure on the player, not a mitigation based on the opponents positioning. your opponent cannot mitigate this to any large extent. and the argument about having blocking terrain in the way is almost moot, as the terrain would block the spears too.

 

[Boshea]

Spears look cooler, therefore are better.

 

[Seraphage]

Spears look cooler, therefore are better.

Haha we have a winner here - rule of cool is THE rule after all !

Still a very interesting conversation and due to your discussion I will give it a shot in actual fight *been experienced with hordes so I do trust the pile in of mine* and will let you know how it'd go ( probably not that soon since I m working day to night the whole July )

 

[Canas]

In those photos you are not base to base with your (yellow/banner) models. if you actually move them up to true base to base, they get to attack. I appreciate the effort to substantiate your opinon.... you have no idea how many times people just say something then never back it up.. but in this case you are not actually moving your units into the appropriate spots to maximize the attacks. in a game this would be a a failure on the player, not a mitigation based on the opponents positioning. your opponent cannot mitigate this to any large extent. and the argument about having blocking terrain in the way is almost moot, as the terrain would block the spears too.

then show me a picture where the opponent has positioned like this, ensuring that there are gaps like this where you manage to get em all in. Cuz I can't get them in any more than ~50% of the 2nd rank being able to reach as the other half is Always opposite those gaps. The picture I simply took after fiddling with them for a while to try and get more of the 2nd rank into range as it was a good enough representation of the situation.

Do pay in mind that the gaps need to be too small to just slide a saurus into the gap entirely when making the setup. If the gaps are large enough the frontline could just take a step forward and you'd end up with 3 lines making contact even at only 1".

Minor sidenote, gettomg stiff into base to base contact is fiddly, especially when models have bits pointing out. This means that quite rapidly you start pushing other models out of the way on accident when trying to do it, and there's bound to be some people that'l do that accidently on purpose to get a few more guys in range. How quick are people to call foul over that? Cuz the amount of tzaangor I kept knocking over and pushing back to try to make my example was enough to get me annoyed if I had been the tzeentch player...

As for the terrain thing; that was simply a remark to point out that I'm going to assume you can't surround em for whatever reason. Seeing as surrounding them has an influence on how much can fit in the frontline and this discussion is centred around the 2nd line. So no surrounding keeps the examples simpler. And the idea remains the same anyways. It's just that at a max unit size of 40 a big enough frontline would eventually make honeycombing moot.

 

[Killer Angel]

In my case, Spears are clearly better because that's how my sauri are equipped