8th Ed. Restricted power dice and Focused Rumination

[Goat1of4]

I will be in a tournament where the Power dice total will be limited to 12 per phase. That is from all sources including Focused Rumination. Do you think this discipline would still be worth it?

 

[n810]

Do you really need to throw more than 12 a phase?
Is the real question...

 

[Goat1of4]

I have used 20 dice in one phase before. 11 on winds, cast seven spells so seven from FoR and two from a power scroll. Was that the norm? No, but it was a very bad phase for my opponent. You are right though. With an average roll of seven, casting five spells would still put me under the 12 cap.

 

[Arli]

If you can only use Focused Rumination one time, it is a waste, drop it. If you can use it as it is written, then keep it.

 

[Juhaaha]

whats the wording of the restriction?

 

[n810]

@Goat1of4

Q: Do dice that have been ‘removed’ from the pool to cast a spell still
count against the power limit? (p30)
A: Yes. They count against the power limit until the moment
they are rolled, at which point they are ‘used up’ and no longer
count against the power limit.

Q: If I have a special rule that generates power or dispel dice
that doesn’t state when they are added or specifies they are added at
the start of the Magic phase, when are these dice added to the
pool?(p30)
A: They are added after rolling for the Winds of Magic but
before any casting attempts have been made.

Q: Can I use more than 12 power or dispel dice in a phase
even though the pool is limited to 12? (p30)
A: Yes. While the pool can never contain more than 12 power
or dispel dice at any one time, some abilities can generate more
dice part way through a Magic phase

(From the new FAQ released this week)
http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1780263a_FAQ_Warhammer_Rulebook__V1_4.pdf

 

[Coatl]

i think what hes saying n810 is that the tournament is restricting the total power dice used in any magic phase to 12 total i.e. once you have used 12 power dice, you cant cast/dispel anymore. this is clearly not the norm and seems to me another blatant attempt to hinder lizards dominating in the magic phase.

id say your still better off with it, simply because the average of 7 still lets you cast 5 spells and be at the cap of 12. also, poor WoM rolls (the bane of any double slann army) will be mitigated by your boost is power dice. sure you'll have issues if you keep rolling above average for WoM, but id say you should still be able to get a solid 5 spells off effectively.

 

[SanDiegoSurrealist]

This rule really hurts DE and anyone using Death Magic and counting on the extra power dice.

The 12 max power dice is a rule that we use in our restricted league here in San Diego and I still (95% of the time) take Rumination.

It makes a big difference in that one critical magic phase that inevitably happens where a 5 or less is rolled for Winds of magic.

just my $.02

 

[Arli]

I prefer to kite out a lvl1 skink priest with the forbidden rod and the amulet of 4+ vs the first wound. I have been using that combo for the last 3 months in almost every game. I have only lost the priest maybe 3 times. Plus I still get the one heavens spell (usually Iceshard).

I also take a lvl2 priest as well (points allowing) to get a few more heavens spells in.

 

[MI_Tiger]

Our local league also uses that rule (max 12 PD used in a turn regardless of source). The discipline is still VERY worthwhile. Sure, there are times that I waste a few potential dice (on a high PD roll), but nothing beats rolling a 5 for PD and still getting off 3 or 4 spells that the enemy can't dispel.

 

[Goat1of4]

the specific tournament rule is
- A maximum of 12 power dice may be used in any player's magic phase, regardless of how they are generated (Winds of Magic / Channeling / Magic items or abilities / Effects of Spells).

It is a 2200 point game and with my preference for defense I will probably use a Life Slann.

 

[Juhaaha]

In that case, I'd take the rumination.

 

[walach]

hell, i'm going to a tournament with max 12 dice, and no more than 3 bonus dice per phase, and i'm still taking focused rumination. as long as you're getting 2-3 dice per phase from it, it's totally woth 50pts. consider the much maligned banner of sorcery is only +d3 dice for the same points (iirc).

 

[Barotok]

From what I've read/seen FM is still very worthwhile. Only time you could technically not use it is if you're starting your magic phase with 12 dice. After you drop below that limit, the remaining spells benefit from FM.

I would also agree that it is limited in a tourney setting like this especially when you roll well on WoM. Where you will see the benefit is magic phases where you have not rolled well on WoM.

 

[General Cross]

Hang on a minute. The third part of the FAQ says you can go over 12 in total in the magic phase, but you can't have more than 12 dice at any one point.
Correct me if I'm wrong but this is how I'm reading it.

Say if you rolled 11 on winds of magic, used three dice plus the FR to cast your first spell you'd have used 12 dice so far and would have 9 dice left in the power pool. The next spell you cast is 2+FR which means you've used 13 dice in total. However, at the point you cast spell 2 you only have 9 dice in the pool plus one for the FR. Therefore you can use more than 12 dice in the phase as long as the total dice does not exceed 12. The only time you couldn't use FR would be if you rolled a 12 on the winds of magic, and even then after the first spell you could then use it.

Or am I misreading something here?

 

[Arli]

You are right, however, the venue hosting the tournament from the original post is limiting dice to 12 total.