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AoS NEW *rumor*

Nart said:
At least, there are a lot of beautiful alternative models for salamanders. But Saurus... Congrats to saurus-lovers, but I have only 30, and they are hard to get and I don't like them.

I hope, that we will be able to come up with combined arms lists, beast-heavy lists or magic lists. I don't like the things that looks powerful right now.
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With our dependency on support Heroes I don't think mix lists are possible the best you can get is a bunch of skinks in a couple big dinosaurs
 
Erta Wanderer said:
Salamanders are awesome even if the sculpt is Derpy as heck
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Ye. Honestly i like sallies alot. I adore them in total war warhammer 2 but i just dont want to buy their modells

They are in an elite club with kroxigor and astrolith bearer that i like to call. Too derpy even for my taste

Will probably get some eventually either way but thats after i have tried some other lists first
 
Canas said:
you could build a terradon & ripper chief with 1 box without too much trouble. The last remaining model could be an additional chief (with some minor kitbashing) of your choosing, or a random terradon or ripper. It's a bit weird, but it's not that much of a cash grab either.
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Hmm I get that but that's more if you definitely want both rippers and terradons. I've got 3 rippers at the moment and if I want to make a ripper chief to go with them I have to buy a full box. Okay I could make a terradon chief too but if I did I'd have to buy another box of terradons to make it useful.

I love the look of the new tome but this just seems like a missed opportunity by GW.
 
Moulinglacia said:
Ye. Honestly i like sallies alot. I adore them in total war warhammer 2 but i just dont want to buy their modells

They are in an elite club with kroxigor and astrolith bearer that i like to call. Too derpy even for my taste

Will probably get some eventually either way but thats after i have tried some other lists first
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I've got a conversion of some sallies from flesh hounds. Look so much nicer!
 
Alright, I have found something I did want to try out though, also always wanted to put my Endless Spells to use so...


Starborne
Fangs of Sotek

Heros
General : Slann Starmaster (260)
Trait: Great Rememberer
Spell: Celestial Equilibrium

Skink Oracle (260)
Artefact: Dagger Killy thingo
Spell: Tide of Serpents

Skink Priest (70)
Skink Priest (70)
Skink Starpriest (120)
Spell: Celestial Harmony
Skink Starpriest (120)
Spell: Hand of Glory


Battleline
Skink x 40 (240)
Skink x 40 (240)
Skink x 10 (60)
All Boltspitter and shield

Bastiladon (220)
Bastiladon (220)
SOLAR FLARE

Purple Sun (60)
Maelstrom (20)
Quicksilver Swords (40)

That should be 145 wounds if I can math correctly, included I could probably take the Bastiladons out, just not sure what for yet. So what are we doing here? Skinks... So we need a boat load of CP and honestly Im not sure if we can actually do it first turn. So what we're doing is two units of 40 skinks, each getting the benefits from the Starpriest, Priest and the Fangs of Sotek CA, plus the standard reroll of 1 missile attacks CA...so we need 3 CP each for these units, but we will try to settle for 2 each to start. Of course these are from 1 CP for the turn, 1 CP for Great Rememberer on a +4 an additional 2 CP from the Slann on a +4 and a CP each from the Starpriests on a 5+...unlikely, but possible.

So we've kitted these skinks up, what do they get? WELL a unit of 40 all buffed will have 80 attacks Hitting on 4, rerolling 1s, wounding on 5s, MW on 6s, spend a CP and we will do that all again, hell I could even take the Oracle out for a Stegadon Chief, kit 40 of the Skinks with Blowpipes and Clubs and run them in for +3/+4 MW on 6s for 3 attacks each.....might be an idea, but the Oracle does look like a valuable piece.

On top of this we have quite a bit of Magic, if I lack the CP one of my Starpriests can give a unit the rerolls of 1 (this could also tie in nicely with Kamikaze skinks) and the other make them Battleshock immune (but how many are surviving? who knows). Summoning probably wont be huge here but some extra points for extra Skinks could be nice, but mainly our Slann will be slinging out Endless Spells, and make the other little boys better at how well they cast, Throw that Oracle in deep and shoot those spells from the Slann straight out of him.

But let me know what you guys think, and what could be better, the Oracle or Stegadon?

Edit: Actually I'll add it as a question here, so my Skinks with Blowpipes charge, can I use the Sotek CA, have them shoot but them not retreat them? Like I get that I may roll a +4 but do I actually need to move them? So I can then have them fight in combat?
 
Anyone know the exact wording of the Coalesced? Do they ignore all modifiers to their bravery, including the modifiers from losing models?
 
Batch said:
Alright, I have found something I did want to try out though, also always wanted to put my Endless Spells to use so...


Starborne
Fangs of Sotek

Heros
General : Slann Starmaster (260)
Trait: Great Rememberer
Spell: Celestial Equilibrium

Skink Oracle (260)
Artefact: Dagger Killy thingo
Spell: Tide of Serpents

Skink Priest (70)
Skink Priest (70)
Skink Starpriest (120)
Spell: Celestial Harmony
Skink Starpriest (120)
Spell: Hand of Glory


Battleline
Skink x 40 (240)
Skink x 40 (240)
Skink x 10 (60)
All Boltspitter and shield

Bastiladon (220)
Bastiladon (220)
SOLAR FLARE

Purple Sun (60)
Maelstrom (20)
Quicksilver Swords (40)

That should be 145 wounds if I can math correctly, included I could probably take the Bastiladons out, just not sure what for yet. So what are we doing here? Skinks... So we need a boat load of CP and honestly Im not sure if we can actually do it first turn. So what we're doing is two units of 40 skinks, each getting the benefits from the Starpriest, Priest and the Fangs of Sotek CA, plus the standard reroll of 1 missile attacks CA...so we need 3 CP each for these units, but we will try to settle for 2 each to start. Of course these are from 1 CP for the turn, 1 CP for Great Rememberer on a +4 an additional 2 CP from the Slann on a +4 and a CP each from the Starpriests on a 5+...unlikely, but possible.

So we've kitted these skinks up, what do they get? WELL a unit of 40 all buffed will have 80 attacks Hitting on 4, rerolling 1s, wounding on 5s, MW on 6s, spend a CP and we will do that all again, hell I could even take the Oracle out for a Stegadon Chief, kit 40 of the Skinks with Blowpipes and Clubs and run them in for +3/+4 MW on 6s for 3 attacks each.....might be an idea, but the Oracle does look like a valuable piece.

On top of this we have quite a bit of Magic, if I lack the CP one of my Starpriests can give a unit the rerolls of 1 (this could also tie in nicely with Kamikaze skinks) and the other make them Battleshock immune (but how many are surviving? who knows). Summoning probably wont be huge here but some extra points for extra Skinks could be nice, but mainly our Slann will be slinging out Endless Spells, and make the other little boys better at how well they cast, Throw that Oracle in deep and shoot those spells from the Slann straight out of him.

But let me know what you guys think, and what could be better, the Oracle or Stegadon?

Edit: Actually I'll add it as a question here, so my Skinks with Blowpipes charge, can I use the Sotek CA, have them shoot but them not retreat them? Like I get that I may roll a +4 but do I actually need to move them? So I can then have them fight in combat?
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The core of 80 Skinks is where my head is a well. Not sure how good Bastiladons are in this list. I'd take one unit of Sallies for sure, but time will tell! Consider Geminids as an offensive spell. You can also pair it with the Skink Starpriest to give -2
 
Daily reminder to please keep list discussion (especially going forward) out of this thread. Use the dedicated subforum :p
 
Stega said:
Hmm I get that but that's more if you definitely want both rippers and terradons. I've got 3 rippers at the moment and if I want to make a ripper chief to go with them I have to buy a full box. Okay I could make a terradon chief too but if I did I'd have to buy another box of terradons to make it useful.

I love the look of the new tome but this just seems like a missed opportunity by GW.
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Make 3 ripper chiefs, they're cheap enough that using multiple is viable.

And meh, you could always just build the terradon chief for the collecting aspect or just in case you'l get terradons at some point in the future.
Yeah it's a bit weird, but ultimatly I don't think it's that bad.

Batch said:
Edit: Actually I'll add it as a question here, so my Skinks with Blowpipes charge, can I use the Sotek CA, have them shoot but them not retreat them? Like I get that I may roll a +4 but do I actually need to move them? So I can then have them fight in combat?
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I think so, does it say must move or can move? I can't find the command ability anymore, and there's waaaaaaaaaaay to many pages on here to scroll through to find it.

Erta Wanderer said:
well they are just flamers...without the flying... and they are slower....and they have less range...and they cost twice as much... and you can only have 3 of them in a unit.
i think salamanders are fine
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mwha, the salamander is better against higher saves (4+ or better). It's also considerably cheaper (salamanders are 90, flamers 120). It doesn't lose firepower as fast as it has the skinks as ablative wounds.

There is however 1 massive downside to both salamanders & razordons. The skinks might be nice ablative wounds. But if you kill a bunch at the same time you'l trigger battleshock. And at bravery 5 and, 1 wound per skink & a 4+ save this isn't very difficult. Which is a drawback I don't see solved easily. Yeah you can always throw the command ability at it, but that'l rapidly cost you a lot of command points... The handlers are more of a liability than an actual asset like this imho.
 
Canas said:
mwha, the salamander is better against higher saves (4+ or better). It's also considerably cheaper (salamanders are 90, flamers 120). It doesn't lose firepower as fast as it has the skinks as ablative wounds.
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thats 120 for 3 flamers each flamer has the same attacks as a salamander and 3 salamanders are 240 so twice as expencive
 
Joshua Horchler said:
Anyone know the exact wording of the Coalesced? Do they ignore all modifiers to their bravery, including the modifiers from losing models?
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That is also something that I have been wondering, but no. The amount of lost models is a modifier for the battleshock roll itself, not for the Bravery characteristic of the unit. What I totally did not know (I blame my sub 20 games experience) is that you get a +1 modifier to your Bravery for every 10 models in a unit.

/edit: Just realized, the +1 for 10 models only applies for Starborn obviously, lol.
 
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Erta Wanderer said:
thats 120 for 3 flamers each flamer has the same attacks as a salamander and 3 salamanders are 240 so twice as expencive
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can't say that's an entirely fair comperison given that you're comparing a msu with a max sized unit....

Also 3 salamanders massivly outdamage 3 flamers given the additional rend & mortal wounds.
3 flamers will hit about 4 times for D3 damage before saves
3 salamanders will cause 2 D3 mortal wounds + 2 D3 regular hits with -2 Rend before saves
against a 4+ save that becomes:
2D3 mortal wounds + 1.66 D3 wounds for the salamanders
vs.
2D3 wounds for the flamers.

So meh, seems fair enough given that they do almost twice the damage as well.

Though I still don't get the point of handlers now. They just seem like a liabilty now that they don't do anything but trigger battleshock.
 
So after reading on line previews and the warhammer war scrolls, I decided I couldn't wait for the new temple so i decided to scratch build one! Need to add vegetation etc and paint but so far ok......
 

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Erta Wanderer said:
thats 120 for 3 flamers each flamer has the same attacks as a salamander and 3 salamanders are 240 so twice as expencive
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salamanders have 1 more shot and better hit rolls/rend + mortal wounds on 6s to hit, which increases their output a bit. They also have a better save and effectively 3x as many wounds, or 1.5x the wounds of 2 flamers, which are the same points as 1 salamander +3 handlers.

1 salamander averages 4 damage with its shooting with no buffs. 2 flamers average ~5.33 damage. Vs a target with a 4+ save, their average damage is almost the same, with salamanders at ~3.556, and 2 Flamers at ~3.553. Against a 3+ save or better, Salamanders put out more damage, and that's assuming the Flamer is hitting on a 3+.

The Salamander is also far better in melee, since its melee is the same as its shooting in coalesced (potentially better. Salamanders can have a potential 6 attacks per model in melee with the thunderquake buff + coalesced extra jaw attack + skink chief on steg command ability), or 3/4 of its shooting otherwise, while the flamers have awful melee, but a longer range with their shooting and slightly higher movement.
 
Asamu said:
salamanders have 1 more shot and better hit rolls/rend + mortal wounds on 6s to hit, which increases their output a bit. They also have a better save and effectively 3x as many wounds, or 1.5x the wounds of 2 flamers, which are the same points as 1 salamander +3 handlers.

1 salamander averages 4 damage with its shooting with no buffs. 2 flamers average ~5.33 damage. Vs a target with a 4+ save, their average damage is almost the same, with salamanders at ~3.556, and 2 Flamers at ~3.553. Against a 3+ save or better, Salamanders put out more damage, and that's assuming the Flamer is hitting on a 3+.

The Salamander is also far better in melee, since its melee is the same as its shooting in coalesced (potentially better. Salamanders can have a potential 6 attacks per model in melee with the thunderquake buff + coalesced extra jaw attack + skink chief on steg command ability), or 3/4 of its shooting otherwise, while the flamers have awful melee, but a longer range with their shooting and slightly higher movement.
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your forgeting flamers +1 and +2 from unit size but yes over all im siked about salamanders in starborn droping them at 9" nuking somthing and then charging them in on a 8 will make it hard for oponents that want to protect things
 
Steve said:
So after reading on line previews and the warhammer war scrolls, I decided I couldn't wait for the new temple so i decided to scratch build one! Need to add vegetation etc and paint but so far ok......
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what did you make that out of? I can't tell if it's plastic or clay.
 
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