• The forum software have been upgraded to the latest version.

    If you notice anything that looks off, or does not work, please let us know.

    For more information, click here.

AoS NEW *rumor*

I think, that 3 spells per list rule would be enough nerf to BES. I don't think that Knights would be touched at all. I expect only salamanders and kroak to be hit, but in all honesty, spamming salamanders was a bit gimmicky. Best lists had like 6-7, I wouldn't call it a spam. Tzeentch and CoS are also a hard counter for them. I'd make them artillery and give, say 10 points per model pts increase, so the full unit of 3 would be 270 instead of 240. This would stack pretty quickly if one wanted to spam them. It would be sad, if Kroak gets too much punch, because without astrolith and balewind he is not scary at all, but he is an important part of many fun builds, because he provides CP and magic defence. I would divide his increase between himself, astrolith and saurus guard, but give the guard discount for maximum unit to compensate for it.
 
I think one thing that has been overlooked is the little weakling character that can add a lot to our army. As it stands I can make a Stormcast wizard with nothing else for 50 points for a matched play game. So bringing one of the coolest endless spells for us went from a minimum of 240 points to 150 points (everblaze comet).
 
I really don't think custom heroes will become a thing in tournaments. I definitely think they'll be fun in casual games, though.

I've been thinking, what do you guys think we'll need to do as far as competitive list building since everyone seems to think that Salamanders going way up in points is pretty much inevitable, and do you think Kroak will get hit hard as well? Also, do you think we'll see any units *decrease* in points? I think Troglodon might be a candidate there.

Personally I can definitely understand Salamanders going up at least a little bit. I could also see them just being made artillery to limit spamming while keeping the current point cost or only going up by 10 or so. I'm not a fan of "spam unit X" lists. They're not fun to play with or against, imo. But I also think that if we lose Kroak and Salamanders we'll be back to a mid-tier army unless we get some decent buffs in other areas.

I don't really think that we'll see Kroak go up in points enough to make him unplayable, but let's say that worst-case scenario we basically can't use either Kroak or Salamanders effectively anymore. What becomes our new strategy? What sort of lists do we now start looking at?
 
Kilvakar said:
I really don't think custom heroes will become a thing in tournaments. I definitely think they'll be fun in casual games, though.

I've been thinking, what do you guys think we'll need to do as far as competitive list building since everyone seems to think that Salamanders going way up in points is pretty much inevitable, and do you think Kroak will get hit hard as well? Also, do you think we'll see any units *decrease* in points? I think Troglodon might be a candidate there.

Personally I can definitely understand Salamanders going up at least a little bit. I could also see them just being made artillery to limit spamming while keeping the current point cost or only going up by 10 or so. I'm not a fan of "spam unit X" lists. They're not fun to play with or against, imo. But I also think that if we lose Kroak and Salamanders we'll be back to a mid-tier army unless we get some decent buffs in other areas.

I don't really think that we'll see Kroak go up in points enough to make him unplayable, but let's say that worst-case scenario we basically can't use either Kroak or Salamanders effectively anymore. What becomes our new strategy? What sort of lists do we now start looking at?
Click to expand...
I dont think artillery will cut it. People can just bring 4x3 Sallies instead of loads of singles. Will it really have enough of an impact? Probably not. Its certainly easier to kill 4x3 than 12x1 since people need to split attacks/shooting/magic to deal with singles, but 4x3 will still decimate anything you point them at.

This custom hero thing is gonna be annoying - I feel like it will almost be a 50/50 between people using it and those who wont. Will be a nightmare to talk about going forward - “Oh but you just make a Skink like this..” “well we dont play like that around here” - It is basically like the terrain rules from GHB19 in regards to the RSE “problem”. I actually think one of the most broken aspects of the Anvil thing is how cheap you can buy a naked hero - This will be huge for many armies.

Personally if they hammer Salamanders and increase points by 50 each or something stupid - I will go the mass Skinks route in Fangs of Sotek. Nobody talks about how much damage 40 Skinks does with double attacks (over 15 models), +1 hit, rerolls 1’s to hit and 6s to wound is 1 MW in addition, but it is alot. Especially since you can do the shoot and retreat in enemy charge phase too. With 2x40 Skinks it will also be a breeze capping objectives. Terradons might be an alternative to Salamanders for deleting key threats.

I dont it will be that massive increases though - If you look at the other changes in general it is really subtle adjustments like 10 points here and 10 points there.

I hope all our big dinos come down in points - Stegs, Basi, Dread Saurian, Carnosaurs and Trogs. Kroxigors need to come down and Rippers/Terradons too. No amount of points will make Razordons good imo - I will want an offensive unit (Sallies) over a defensive unit any day of the week. Maybe if it was rend 3 when it got charged.
 
I really wouldn't touch the guards if I were GW. They're already a glorified slann upgrade, if they get even more expensive they'l definitly lose all purpose beyond ablative wounds. Might as well just make them part of the slann warscroll at that point.

As for Kroak, the reduction in possible endless spells already breaks his most oppressive combo's. So I wouldn't say it needs any particular nerfs beyond that.

As for Salamanders, they need a point increase but only in Starborne. Which imho would set a good precedent. Allowing different subfactions to have different pointvalues for their units would allow for more genuine variance in subfactions. It'd also allow subfactions to specialize without needing a borderline broken buff to a specific unit as simply having say a 20 point discount on all infantry is a massive boon.
 
Canas said:
I really wouldn't touch the guards if I were GW. They're already a glorified slann upgrade, if they get even more expensive they'l definitly lose all purpose beyond ablative wounds. Might as well just make them part of the slann warscroll at that point.
Click to expand...
I think guards should see point reduction. For about 10-20 pts. Their only purpose is to cover Slann, I always look at them as elite Saurus unit. And I hope they will add battalion for them (maybe adding +1 to save in coalesced and auto shrugging wounds for Slann in starbourne)
 
Guards are honestly pretty insane for what they do. I dont think theres any other unit in the game that can simply pass off wounds on a 2+. Most other "bodyguard" effects are on a 4+ I believe? Might be wrong on that, but certainly not on 2+.

I think it would be hard to make Guards and Warriors different in a way that makes sense. Warriors are already sort of this huge block of models while the Knights are the hammer. I think if you made Guards too good you just wouldnt see Warriors used - Guards as Anvil and Knights as Hammer.
 
Grotpunter said:
Guards are honestly pretty insane for what they do. I dont think theres any other unit in the game that can simply pass off wounds on a 2+. Most other "bodyguard" effects are on a 4+ I believe? Might be wrong on that, but certainly not on 2+.

I think it would be hard to make Guards and Warriors different in a way that makes sense. Warriors are already sort of this huge block of models while the Knights are the hammer. I think if you made Guards too good you just wouldnt see Warriors used - Guards as Anvil and Knights as Hammer.
Click to expand...
Well, it makes sense. But as the owner of 30 of them I would like to use them somewhere else, rather than a 5-10 bodyguards for my Slann :D:D:D.
I mean, if they had 3+ Save I wouldn't say a word. Knights are damage dealers, Guards are tanks and Warriors something in between - they can punch, they can take a hit, while being 10 pts cheaper (+horde discount) than other 2.
 
Grotpunter said:
Guards are honestly pretty insane for what they do. I dont think theres any other unit in the game that can simply pass off wounds on a 2+. Most other "bodyguard" effects are on a 4+ I believe? Might be wrong on that, but certainly not on 2+.
Click to expand...
O sure, they're great ablative wounds. But that's literally all they are. And only for 1 unit. Which they're completly glued to if they want to do there job.

It's just kind of a waste of a warscroll. I'd rather just have a warscroll "slann + guard" if all they're going to be is ablative wounds. At least then they act as 1 unit.

Grotpunter said:
I think it would be hard to make Guards and Warriors different in a way that makes sense. Warriors are already sort of this huge block of models while the Knights are the hammer. I think if you made Guards too good you just wouldnt see Warriors used - Guards as Anvil and Knights as Hammer.
Click to expand...
Warriors are for hordes & fodder
Guards are elite defensive MSU option
Knights for hammers & mobility.

Shouldn't be too diffuclt to distinguish those three.
 
Guards a bit strange. I love the fact they have 2 wounds. Their 3+3+ is fairly easy to turn into a 2+2+ in coalesced. -1 rend, 1 damage. 21 attacks from a unit of 5. But... 4+ save, no battalion, and 1" melee range. Also, the Eternity Warden CA is good but overlaps with the Koatl's Claw +1 to attack CA you get.

Saurus Guard are good in concept, and certainly good when paired with a Slann. (I had 5 Saurus Guard practically take down Thanquol)

If I were to improve them. Keep the save the same. 2" melee range. Battalion would be a carbon copy of the previous battalion. +1 to save rolls and d3 damage if they haven't moved this around. I would also give the Eternity Warden a new CA. Maybe +1 to wound, or gives a unit FNP on a 5+?
 
Played 2 games yesterday ~200 points down, giving me plenty of room for Kroak and Salamander increases. It still felt really strong, definitely looking forward to seeing what the actual changes are.
 
ILKAIN said:
I believe its named after the Death guard ability in 40k. but I could be wrong.
Click to expand...

Death Guard/All Nurgle stuff is Disgustingly Resilient. I think it's either Iron Hands or Iron Warriors.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top