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7th Ed. Myan, not Aztec lol

Guardian of Hexoatl
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Guardian of Hexoatl

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Just felt like posting this cuz everybody seems to think Lizardmen are based on Aztecs lol :D

- Sotek - Quetzlcoatl (Myan Serpent God).
- Pyramid setup - Myans aligned there temple cities with the alignment of numerous celestial bodies.
- Both have similar interpretations of time
- Both prophecise of external influences were made, and were correct. (Spanish soldiers and Skaven)
- Polar warp gates spewing out chaos? The center of the galaxy which the myans believe is a portal to the under wold? Similar much?

There are just dozens of similarities between the Lizardmen and the Myans. Hope that clears up any confusion :D
 
I believe that the fluff was borrowed not just from the Mayan, but also from Aztec and Incan cultures.
Generally to those not heavily invested in learning the differences of the three cultures, there's enough passing similarities between them that they are considered interchangeable to a point as far as inspiration for fantasy themes go.

I believe that the Jaguar warriors were Aztec for example.
And the heavy use of obsidian/gold/silver colourings for weapons and jewelry is more of an Incan thing.
 
Not to get too uppity abut this, but a few points of note:

Quetzalcoatl is an Aztec deity as well. The Mayas ("Mayan" is an adjective) referred to it as Kukulcan, but it's basically the same "feathered serpent" god.

The Aztecs were the ones that ran afoul of Spanish imperialism. As I understand it, Mayan culture had had it's sunset well before the Conquistadors showed up. (It is a great analogy between Skaven and the European invaders, now that you mention it.)

I think Games workshop probably borrowed from both civilizations, especially as you said the religious and philosophical perspective of the Mayas.
 
If it was from myans (ignoring the comments) when does the lizardmens calender end?
 
I said similar, not the same. And technically the myan calendar dosn't end lol
The end of the fourth Baktun of their calender is just the restarting of the cycle. They believe it will then begin a new (through an event involving water in some way). That's why there calander is circular lol There calender is a lot more complex than the everage 2012 viewer or even the occasional history channel viewer ;) Not saying you are, just stating the complexity.
 
Yeah I have heard that they are more Mayan than Aztec.. Really, as Caeldan said, I don't really know enough about the differences to know. They are native south Americans. I guess everyone says Aztec because Aztec are more popular in today's culture so more well known.

Weren't the Aztec more warlike? Did both do human sacrifices, or just one?

And yeah Skaven and other races invading the jungles stealing treasures is definitely in line with the Spanish attacking. Hopefully though (and so far so good) in the warhammer world, the result of the war turns out a little differently. ;)
 
I couldn't agree more Strewart. The outcome would be way different in lustria. Nothing Beats the scaley folk :D And good point as well. The Aztecs were much more warlike.
 
I had a chance to visit the Mayan ruins at Tulum and Chichen Itza a while back... Utterly spectacular. There was a spot in front of the main temple at Tulum where, on various, precise days of the year certain celestial bodies would be visible through several windows that go clear through the top of the structure. With no more technology than those people had, their astronomy and architecture was beyond remarkable.

I missed out on seeing any of the Aztec sites, but the others that went told me they were breathtaking as well. From what I could tell, the Aztecs didn't seem to have nearly the grasp of astronomy that the Mayas did, but they made up for it with scale.
 
I think its safe to say the Lizardmen are mish-mash combo of 'Meso-American' societies (sort of like how the Dark Elves seem to be a mix of different peoples). I think it works well, especially given (someone else pointed this out somewhere) that the Fantasy industry usually ignores or barely gives any attention to the Native American (or "Indian" if you're from Oklahoma) societies.

Anyway, the Mayan did do sacrifice, but it was around ~14/year. The Aztecs are a society that came after the Mayans, picked up on the human sacrifice thing & really ran w/ it. The Mayans had the idea you sacrifice people for certain, special holidays or reasons. The Aztecs took this idea but added the extra "if we sacrificed one person last year & that worked/didn't work (got rain or something), then we need to sacrifice at least 2 people or the gods are going to be displeased." Thus, started an empire who had a drive to expand simply b/c they needed more bodies constantly. You can see evidence of this when the Spanish showed up & the outlying tribes allied w/ the Spanish to overthrow the Imperial Aztecs (it seemed like a good idea at the time).

Of course the reported numbers & actual numbers of sacrifice range from true to speculative to almost completely made up. I read once that during ONE festival right before the Spanish showed up the Aztecs sacrificed 70,000 (SEVENTY THOUSAND) people.

The Cult of Sotek seems to be more based on the Aztecs due to the numbers. I dont have the book atm, but I don't remember instances of the LM sacrificing anyone else but Skaven. It'll be interesting, with Mazmudii now in charge, to see if 8th E allows the LM to start aggressively expanding (or reclaiming) their empire. At least give me the Southlands back...
 
Good post; that was the basic understanding I got from talking to a friend that majored in Mesoamerican history. He said that the Aztecs would go to full scale war for no other reason than to capture enemies to sacrifice. The part in the army book fluff where they describe blood cascading down the steps of the pyramid is no exaggeration, if some of the reports are accurate. You know, that gives me an idea...

In the next army book, our unique character Tehenhauin should have a special "sacrifice" rule. For example, if his unit pursues and captures an enemy unit of man sized models, the army gets some sort of bonus based on the number of guys they caught- the more sacrifices, the better the blessing form the Old Ones. As is, he's a pretty poor Lord level choice, and something like this would add some interesting dynamics.

By the way, Guardian, since you're interested in the subject, you definitely owe it to yourself to see some of the ruins in Mexico up close. The National Museum of Anthropology in Mexico city is worth a trip by itself.
 
The Tehuhain (sp) idea is pretty cool. Before I finished reading it I thought "I would consider actually taking him then."
 
yeah,
I cannot fathom this. Its a combination of those cultures. However I fashoind mine after some of the smaller groups. look up the Yanomani, be a complete jackface to the other races when allies come a knocking. Also I got a masters in paleontology so if you want to talk about stegodon and carnosaur or any other reptile stuff I can help =) outta my element.
 
Awesome! I'm aiming for paleontology myself :D Glad to know someone that is truly passionate about paleontology! (Now your name totaly makes sense lol)
 
you're offically my new BFF on the forums lol. Pac West eh, found some nice finds out that way. Im in Texas.
 
Awesome. I'm planning on transferring to Pen State in a year and a half or so :D I'm gonna be a senior in high school and a sophomore in college next fall (Thank you running start lol).
 
Penn State not bad choice my friend.
Well if there is anythign you want to talk about in geosciences let me know Im sure I can give you some kind of answer.

Also


8th edition, kinda iffy about how this is going to turn out. I am looking foward to new lists however im using a 500+ slaan, I dont think that is good for the 50% or 25% rule. But might actuall field some Kroxigor now becuse of it.

Only time will tell. I just hate the face depending on my schdual, the time my 2250 list gets completed 8th edition will be relased and I prolly will lose most of my troops becuse of this rule. Yet I dont mind the new play styles and updated ruleset. If there were only 40k lizardmen.
 
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