8th Ed. Lizzies at 1k

[Dog On Todd]

Should we be running a scar-vet + Priest in most situations?

Or is 1 character enough? All-comers of course.

I've been playing an either Scar-vet OR Priest, but never run both at this point limit. Isn't 90ish more points better spent elsewhere?

The second hero could buy me a salamander, or go half-way to a stegadon! I just can't see either a priest or a scar-vet matching this for the points.

Thoughts?

 

[Lord Tsunami]

it is insanity not to bring a priest (all those wasted magic dice...)

a scar vet has very little usage in such tiny games. there is no need for single characters with stubborn to delay big units, because there are usually not very many big units around. his combat powers are nice for a hero, but still he is horribly inefficient point for point when it comes to killing. bring more warriors instead. the scar vet does not provide any extra Ld for the sauruses, making him less usefll still.

it MIGHT be an option to get a priest and a saurus BSB. the rerolls on Ld is very nice, though he is costly for such small battles. it may be an option though...

and NO, it is not worth bringing a skink chief

 

[Dog On Todd]

So in summary,

Either:
A) Priest

or

B) Priest + Scar-vet if I wanted to run a scar vet?

 

[vapor]

It really depends on what the rest of your list looks like. I've had a lot of luck with:

Skink Priest-- Lvl 2, Plaque of Tepok

Skink Chief-- BSB, light armor, shield, Burning Blade

21 +2 Skrox, FC

20 Saurus, FC

10 Skirmishers

10 Skirmishers

6 Chameleon Skinks

Sally, extra crew

Chief goes in Skrox block to give rerolls and add some burning attacks against regen, Priests goes in one of the Skirmish units.

 

[Qupakoco]

Chief goes in Skrox block to give rerolls and add some burning attacks against regen, Priests goes in one of the Skirmish units.

That set up works really well, especially for the smaller battles.

I recently did 500 point a LM vs LM battle with my brother-in-law. (He is considering starting an army) I used a lvl 2 priest, 3 krox, and a unit of saurus. He used a scar-vet on a cold-one, a unit of saurus and a unit of TG. Unfortunately his Scar-vet never saw combat thanks to Chain-Lightning. But that is just one scenario out of many. I'm sure it could have been much different if the dice were not on my side.

 

[Dog On Todd]

It really depends on what the rest of your list looks like. I've had a lot of luck with:

Skink Priest-- Lvl 2, Plaque of Tepok

Skink Chief-- BSB, light armor, shield, Burning Blade

21 +2 Skrox, FC

20 Saurus, FC

10 Skirmishers

10 Skirmishers

6 Chameleon Skinks

Sally, extra crew

Chief goes in Skrox block to give rerolls and add some burning attacks against regen, Priests goes in one of the Skirmish units.

I like the list!

My fear with the Skink BSB in Skrox is that they could just focus a few frontline attacks on him, and you lose BSB (victory points).

 

[erians]

Characters can't join Skrox units, their troop type is unique (which means they can't be joined by chars).

 

[Lord Tsunami]

lol. i didnt know that. yet another kick in the skink chiefs already broken teeth

PS. Scar vet BSB or none

 

[erians]

Yeah, but on the upside Skrox units can't be stomped / thunderstomoed or target by Dreaded 13 soell.

 

[vapor]

Characters can't join Skrox units, their troop type is unique (which means they can't be joined by chars).

Got a page reference for that? "Unique" isn't listed on the unit types a character isn't allowed to join on P. 97.

 

[Ronisman]

Characters can't join Skrox units, their troop type is unique (which means they can't be joined by chars).

Hey this is the second thread in which this has come up recently

Here is what I posted in the first thread where I saw it:

The rules state that a character is normally permitted to join units of infantry, beasts, calvary, monstrous infantry, monstrous beasts, or monstrous cavalary. True that unique is not listed there.

The rules however also state that characters cannot join units of monsters, flyers, chariots, swarms, or war machines. Unique isn't listed there either.

The rulebook addresses "Unique" units by saying that all of their particulars will be addressed in your individual army's rulebook. The LM army book doesn't say anything specifically about a character joining a skrox unit.

So far we are neutral on the issue at worst.

There are a couple more things to consider. Skrox are made up of infantry and monstrous infantry. Both of which are unit types that characters can join. You cannot stomp/thunderstomp skrox because they are not wholly comprised of infantry, but they are wholly comprised of unit types that you can join with a character.

The second thing is that kroxigor are technically an upgrade to a regiment of skinks which changes their unit type and adds in one big model for every at least 8. Characters have no problem joining skink units, so really they are just joining an upgraded skink unit.

I say putting a skink chief in with a skrox unit is 100% legitimate.

Haven't heard the counter arguments to it yet. We ought to figure out a consensus and post it in its own thread or something maybe. This seems like a pretty tricky subject.

 

[erians]

Well as you mentioned the rule book states that characters can only join specific unit types, unique is not one of those types.

The rulebook addresses "Unique" units by saying that all of their particulars will be addressed in your individual army's rulebook. The LM army book doesn't say specifically that characters CAN join a skrox unit, which would have to be the case for them to be allowed to join it. The rules always only list what the unit CAN do, not what they can't. It doesn't state that Salamanders and Stegadons can't join the unit either. Unique troops state specifically what can join them and going strictly RAW that means no mentioning of characters = no characters can join.

Rules as written: Its pretty clear that skink chars can't join skrox units, I don't see how you could argue otherwise from a RAW perspective.
Rules as intended: They used to be able to join in 7th and the book is from 7th so it's pretty safe to assume that GW intended that chars could join skrox units at least in 7th and I see no reason why 8th should be different.

Either way skink chars in skrox units is a complete fluff choice, so I don't think anyone would argue if you took it.

There are a couple more things to consider. Skrox are made up of infantry and monstrous infantry. Both of which are unit types that characters can join. You cannot stomp/thunderstomp skrox because they are not wholly comprised of infantry, but they are wholly comprised of unit types that you can join with a character.

What Skrox units are made up of is irrelevant because they are a different unit when separated and have a different unit type. When you combine them they become a completely new unit.

Since most of all Unique units can't be joined by characters anyway (fanatics, screaming bell, plaque furnace) I don't really know if there is any prejudices in the other books, but that would help a lot.

 

[Ronisman]

The rules always only list what the unit CAN do, not what they can't. It doesn't state that Salamanders and Stegadons can't join the unit either.

The rules do state that these things cannot join units though. It is in the main rulebook; only characters join units. Also, the book does primarily list what CAN happen and not what CANNOT happen as you mentioned. However they do both for characters joining units. If they give a list of units characters can join and a list of units characters cannot join; I don't see how you can give precedence to one over the other.

Since most of all Unique units can't be joined by characters anyway (fanatics, screaming bell, plaque furnace) I don't really know if there is any prejudices in the other books, but that would help a lot.

Yes true, but I don't think these units are very similar to skrox despite sharing a unit type, because the "Unique" type is just where all manner of not units not immediately recognizable as a particular category get thrown. Also GW is adamant about keeping characters from joining anything with compulsory movement/actions which include many "Unique" type units.

The LM army book doesn't say specifically that characters CAN join a skrox unit, which would have to be the case for them to be allowed to join it.

See, since characters can join units as per the big rule book, I see this as not telling you either way. The big rules tell you what types of units a character can and cannot join and tell you to see your army book about unique units, and the army book doesn't say anything. I just read that as neutral, but I definitely see why you would take that as confirmation that characters cannot join skrox.

Either way skink chars in skrox units is a complete fluff choice, so I don't think anyone would argue if you took it.

Lol; in fact your opponent would probably encourage you to take all the skink chiefs in skrox units that you want. That way you've just wasted points on a skink chief...

I think if we were to debate this at a tournament on a RAW basis, the ref would probably side with you. Maybe I should ask over at the big warhammer forum and see what they think? It's sort of a moot point... but I am really curious about it nonetheless.

 

[erians]

Yeah I'm curious as well. The only time I see it being useful to know is in armies with Skrox units instead of saurus where any skink priests needs a bunker but other than that it won't matter much. Either way its good to know for sure.

 

[BEEGfrog]

Unit type for skrox is still not definitively defined. Nowhere is it specified as "unique" (unless someone can point out where it is specified). Skaven with screaming bell are specifically defined as unique, but skrox aren't.

The unit is mixed so it cannot be stomped as it isn't one of the specified types, similarly the dreaded 13th attacks specific unit types so skrox are immune. The status of such mixed units is unclear, if units have characters different from their base type then they have a type the same as their base type with the different type from the character ignored. Other types of mixing are not covered.

 

[n810]

I believe mixed units are covered in the BRB and outr army book,
not sure if charcters are mentioned thogh.

 

[vapor]

Unit type for skrox is still not definitively defined. Nowhere is it specified as "unique" (unless someone can point out where it is specified). Skaven with screaming bell are specifically defined as unique, but skrox aren't.

The unit is mixed so it cannot be stomped as it isn't one of the specified types, similarly the dreaded 13th attacks specific unit types so skrox are immune. The status of such mixed units is unclear, if units have characters different from their base type then they have a type the same as their base type with the different type from the character ignored. Other types of mixing are not covered.

FAQ 1.4
Q: Can you Stomp or Thunderstomp a unit of Skinks that
contains Kroxigor? (p94)
A: No, a mixed unit has the troop type of Unique.

And now we need to wait for another FAQ to decide if characters can join because it really could go either way.

 

[Arli]

That will probably take until the new book comes out (several years from now). I have always played it that characters can join the unit (in 8 th edition). No one has ever had a problem with it. I even ran one like that in a local tournament last year.

 

[Moniker]

Well the BRB unhelpfully lists skinks as infantry, but not Skrox specifically... so if you're just going by that they're infantry with upgrades the same as banners, champ, etc. Though... do Skrox get stomps for the Krox involved?

 

[Arli]

The removal of the great reach rule not only made it impossible for the krox to be targeted, it made it impossible for them to stomp as well. Unless they are in base to base contact with an enemy, the krox cannot stomp.