7th Ed. Lizardmen ws. Shooting Elves

[Aparach]

Anyone who can give some adwise on how to take on an Dark Elves/Wood Elves army where theire main tactic is a rain of arrows, making Porcupines of my dinosaurs
We'r talkin 1000-2000 pts here..

 

[Dalkarius]

SKINKS! Ahem, I have faced a number of shooting-armies-of-death and I can say without a doubt, a powerful Slann and skinks can help. Big dinosaurs draw too much attention, while you can take a bunch of Scout Core troops that are at -1 to shoot along with chameleons at -2 to screen or kill (b/c most shooty elves have a bad save) and you can easily hide fast moving Kroxigors and Salamanders, cause I can tell you, them Sallies can burn a shooting unit to a crisp in one move.

So I'd say speed, ranged attacks, and well placed units behind thick enough screens and terrain make or break shooters. Best of luck. And don't forget the Slann, check out the Magic for Which Armies thread for help with spells if you need it.

-Dalkarius

 

[Aparach]

Thanx a lot!
Never really used those cammelions anyway, so that should be interesting.
I had a go her a couple of days ago, were I was met by 60 arrows from repeater crossbowmen and 3 volleys from reaper bolt throwers. Did a mess out of my steggi and kroxigors who didnt even reach the front line
I got 3 new sallys here the other day. Think I should go for them in the next round.
I had a good experience with my 2 gen Slann and a skink priest. Hurling forked lightning and uranus thunderbolt at those bolt throwers really was effectiv!

Here is the army I used:

GENERAL:
Slann 2.nd generation, The Divine Plaque of Protection, Plaque of Dominion, 585 pts
"Ankhazlat of Lustria" Battelstandard

CHARACTERS:
Skink priest: lev. 2, glyph Necklase, 130 pts
"Tzatenq of Aymara Swamps"

Scar-Veteran: Aura of Quetzl, Charm of the Jaguar Warrior, 143 pts
shield, light armour, great weapon

CORE:
10 Temple Guard with full command, shield 215 pts
16 Saurus Warriors full command 222 pts
10 Skink with javelins and shield 60 pts
10 Skink with javelins and shield 60 pts
10 Skink with javelins and shield 60 pts

SPECIAL:
3 Terradon with a brave, hand weapons 115 pts
3 Kroxigor 174 pts

RARE:
1 Stegadon 235 pts

= 1.999 pts

I was totally wiped out, but see that I probobly should have targeted those festering bolt throwers. (Grumbels some gibberish to my self while I'm eating my toast..)

 

[the ironfoot]

mabye lore of shadows might be good? the first spell, steed of shadows is rather nice to throw your kroxigors to your enemy a turn sooner.

 

[Aparach]

You can't use Steed of Shadow on units, only characters, and only with a unit strenght of 1...
I used Steed of Shadow on my Scar-Vet however, and realy put a mach up against Morathi in round 1. He held her up in 4 or 5 rounds, making their magic phase a walkover for my slann

 

[Doom Lizard]

Which elves were you fighting. While i know how destructive Asrai archery is (They are my main army) I also know that almost nothing in their army has an armor save. Scouting skinks and chameleons are the best way to go. They are good at killing bolt thrower crews as well.

 

[Aparach]

I'll keep that in mind Doom Lizard, and thanx for the adwise
I was fighting Dark Elves. Something like this:

Morathi
Malus Darkblade

unit of crossairs
5 cold ones
unit of Black Guard
3 units of Repeater crossbowmen units (10 each)
3 Reaper Bolt Throwers

Possibly even more, but mainly my bane become the bolt throwers and the repeater crossbowmen...

 

[doom_diver]

Well use a faster unit. Try putting a Saurus with Steed Of Shadows and a unit of Calvary. That should put in some speed. Or even a Carnosaur

 

[Doom Lizard]

Yeah before x-bowmen in a DE army were a joke but now they are lethal. Whoda thunk that adding AP to a weapon would make it so much scarrier. Yeah scouting skinks/chamo's should be the solution to your problem.

 

[Aparach]

Think I will go with the skink/cammo skinks tacticks.
Saurus Cavalery and Carnosaurs become obvious targets for a bolt thrower and make easy prey and should be used against thougher targets with less attack I think.. But thats just my oppinion.

 

[Ninjaskink]

Also, a scouting FSoD may be able to deal with the Repeater Bolt Thrower crewmen. His high movement and flight can get you into combat on turn 1 and with their lack of armor and lesser toughness, the skink chief might actually get the kills. And from there, you have a character that can march block behind their lines, and can rear charge those X-bow units. He'll probably die, but it's only about 100 points to keep his artillery out of the game.

 

[Aparach]

Hmmm yeah.. I see your point, but wouldn't terradons do a better job at a lower cost? with their higher T rate and number of attachs, they'r also more likely to survive a flying charge then a skink, don't you think?

By the way: can someone fill me in on those terms FSoD and SoD an alike? Kinda newbee here

 

[Ninjaskink]

FSoD = Flying Skink of Doom (skink priest w/ cloak of feathers)
JSoD = Jaguar Saurus of Doom (Scar Vet or Old Blood w/ jaguar charm)

Yes, the Terradons can do this job as well, but you missed the key word "scouting".

It will usually take your terries a turn to get across the board or get into position to make an effective charge against these units. And in that turn, your opponent has the chance to light up those dinos with x-bow and repeater bolts or asrai arrows. With the FSoD, you're already half way across the board. And with scouts, you can set up on the same side of the board as the artillery, ensuring they don't see where you placed your hunters before deploying their war machines.

Not that I'm anti-terradon mind you. As I stated, the terries also do the job well. Their only problem is that if the opponent knows what they do, and masses his or her fire from one of his shooty units on them, they can get shot to pieces before getting the job done.

 

[Nerdling]

I am having the same problem with an Empire army that I play often. He has tons of gunners and artillery and usually destroys my Oldblood army. I am going to try a slann with fire and heavens today and see how that turns out.

 

[Aparach]

Thanx Ninjaskink for help with terms

You know, you just convinced me!
Realy sounds like a tactic can do the trick, and I'll give it a shot in my next match against the Druchii.

What do you think of this army? Notice only skirmishers and saurus(joining Slann) unit with -1 to hit with shooting.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
GENERAL:
Slann 4.th generation, Divine Paque of Protection, Plaque of Dominion, 400 pts
Battelstandard

Skink Priest Level 2 100 pts

Scar-Veteran: Charm of the Jaguar Warrior, Blessed Spawning of Quetzl 124 pts
"Loqkai of Pahuax" shield, light armour

Skink Chief Cloak of Feathers, 117 pts
blowpipe, shield, light armor, scout

CORE:
16 Saurus Warriors with full command, 262 pts
Sun Standard of Chotec
10 Skink with blowpipes scouts 70 pts
10 Skink with blowpipes scouts 70 pts
10 Skink with blowpipes 60 pts
10 Skink with blowpipes 60 pts
11 Skink with blowpipes 66 pts
2 Swarms 120 pts

SPECIAL:
5 Camelon skinks 75 pts
5 Camelon skinks 75 pts
4 Terradon 140 pts

RARE:
2 Salamander 130 pts
2 Salamander 130 pts

= 1.999 pts
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

[doom_diver]

I would only change your Skink Cheif. If you can move some points out I'd use Staff Of The Lost Suns. I find that it is very effective.

 

[Aparach]

But then he cant have the Cloak of Feathers which is essencial...
Besides i'd like him in close combat with a warmachine-crew. If he don't kill 'em and stays alive he block at least one Bolt of doom...
I hate Bolt-Throwers, I mean really!

 

[Ninjaskink]

You missed a small but crucial piece on the JSoD (partially my fault). Usually you also equip him with a great weapon to increase his lethality. The Always Strikes Last rule is hardly a hindrance to the lizardmen anyway (as the only thing that used to go after them were zombies... and I'm not even sure about that anymore) and the 18" charge lets you hit first against most things. To add this, drop that 11th skink in the one odd unit.

And instead of a blowpipe, I'd swap to two hand weapons. The idea with him is that he deploys with the scouts, but seperates at the start of your second turn (the first will usually be spent leaving cover and setting up the charge) and flies into the War Machine crew. The extra attack will almost assuredly come in handy since you'll probably be in close combat from turn 2 onward, and while the blowpipe might help in turn 1, it might not match up points wise as that extra CC attack might. You can keep the shield though, as on turn 1 you'll want that +1 armor save vs. the ranged attacks that might come your way. Just remember to state that you're changing to two hand weapons before starting the charge if you choose to do so. It'd be a waste to not use the thing if you take it.

 

[Aparach]

Well, when thinking of that I'm gonna fight Dark Elves, and that The only person in that army that has T4 is Malekith himself(the rest 3 exept dragon, maticore and pegasus) i don't think it nessesary, but the extra handweapon appeald to me

 

[Dalkarius]

Quick note, I believe Chameleons are a 0-1 unit so don't take two units of 5, take one of 10.