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7th Ed. Lizardmen Vs Vampire Counts

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kbind847

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With the relese of the new Lizardmen, my vampire count playing friend is "really pumped" to play against me and my 7th edition Lizzies. Apparentlly he bought a dragon JUST because of the new lizardmen book, and is planning a list that goes something like this:

Blood Knights
Black Knights
Skellies to fill core requirements
Corpse Cart
Dragon with a Vamp Lord
Wraiths with a Banshee

I'm sure there is more to the list but I am unsure on the amount of pts going into each unit. However I was seeking any advice to counter such a power heavy list. Do I push the magic option and hope I can bring his units down to a managable sizes for my stegs or sarus to deal with, or do I match his muscle with an Oldblood + Carn. combo?
I am partial to the idea of magicing the heck out of him, a sort of revenge for all those times he casted the same spell 800 times or started the game with a unit of 10 skellies and by the time I got there it was upwards of 25...
Aywho, any advice or suggestions would be awesome! Thanks!
 
I have a poor opinion of heroes riding monster mounts, as the lack of a plus to armor always seems dumb. I would recommend..... Stegadons! Not ancient either... use the Giant bow and chunk crap at the zombie dragon, with any luck you'll harpoon the bastard off his dragon and make him cry, and the plus to strength is wasted on fighting skellies so just throw the steg into the pile with some skink blocks and make em crumble. Personally, I have had amazing luck with a Skink chief and the Stegadon war Spear, it is seemingly the ultimate hammer unit for the lizardmen.

I would also recommend....Chameleons! March Blocking will make the knights come to you slower, and on that subject I would recommend using what is, in my opinion, the best unit in the game. The king's wall. It comes in the Battle for Skull pass set, it's 100 cm long, 20 cm wide, and all awesome. Park some Temple Guard behind that and tell the Knights to sit on it. Without their lances they aren't going to beat you. A hill is also a nice touch to the "castling" strategy. Don't worry about the grave guard knights, they really aren't as scary as some of the scary knights out there.

VC magic is a problem, but it is really unique in that it tends not to go "you die" and says "I live", the banner of Dominion is hilarious, and I recommend it, it turns Setra into Mum-ra, Carstein into Chocula, and Tzeentch into Khorne. Trust me, all it has to do is make one vampire stupid once, and the tactical disadvantage will let you jump in and make him sad, plus he won't cast that turn, or go anywhere. Also, Skinks, in blocks, they are cheap, they break ranks, and they can screen, take 2 groups of ten with musicans and pretend they are a detachment.

Also, have the slann take some powerstones and the Cupped hands, and have someone else take the curse charm, all it needs to do is hod the miscast onto his general and Jynx him into a low number and you win, plus it lets you go balls out on casting something horrible like spirit of the forge and hope for multiple sixes, which could win you the game anyway, or just cancel out scrolls.
 
Take the Engine of the Gods! Against Undead you're sitting at D6 Str 5 hits with no armor saves allowed against all units, even if engaged in close combat! Plus the VC's can't Dispel it. Trust me, I've taken the Engine against all kinds of armies, and it always reels in around 1000-1500 points for me because it is so amazing! Anyone who says not to take an Engine probably hasn't tried it!

Do that, you're good.
 
for a 2500 pt list I was thinking something like this against VC:

Slann
cube
3 powers (plus the free one)
cupped hands of the old ones
bsb

Lv2 Skink on EotG
tepok
rod of storm

Lv2 Skink
cloak of feathers

Skink chief on ancient Steg
war spear

15 spear Sarus
full command

15 Sarus
full command

20 temple guard
full command
war drum

3 Terradons
brave

2 salamanders
2 extra skinks

2 Razerdons
2 extra skinks


basically the two rare choices cover my flanks, Terradons march block, I keep the EotG in my center among the blocks of sarus, with the chief/ancient close. Id move twords him magicing the crap out of anything that poses an immediate threat, then double charge with a steg and a block of sarus or temple guard and a steg/sarus.

Idk, what do you think against VC keeping in mind that dragon will be headed my way along with black knights and blood knights. Is that enough support to hold up if and when he does engage me? Or should I drop the skink with the cloak and fatten up my blocks of sarus?
 
What ever you do, watch out for the blood knights. They are extremely dangerous. Try killing them with the engine or bait & flee them with a cheap unit (they are frenzied).

Also take the lore of light for your slann. It rocks against undead.

Good luck with your battle!!
 
EotG and the slann ability to take all 6 spells of a lore (Light) are amazing combo against VC
 
Actually with that UD army I would take metal for the slan, get rid of the knights and bansees the rest of the army will fall. Honestly I want to try this if you can, saurus oldblood with the LD test instant kill blade against the zombie dragon, I just wanna see a monster die failing a ld test.
 
HOly crap I totally forgot about that weapon...hmmmm a slann with uber sweet magic against undead, or the swweeeeeeet taste of watching a zombie dragon fall to my blade the second turn of the game......and possibly the vampire as well. What is the Ld of a zombie dragon?
 
a normal dragon beast thing should have a Ld of 5.

most beasts have Ld5.

so the blade of ultimate doom or the frog of ultimate doom, your choice.
 
Don't underestimate the power of jungle swarms!!!. They are great to occupy a unit of 40 zombies or skellies. After this you can focus on his more dangerous elites (Ive had games were jungle swarms duked it out with his zombies whole game). Also keep in mind jungle swarms are unbreakable and would be great to run into some of his more important units to cripple them then take them out with those sexy s5 hits from EoTG. So yeah jungles swarms = <3
 
How long would jungle swarms last against a ranked unit of skellies or zombies? With their static CR of 4 or 5 I would be losing a swarm every cc pahse. Swarms take wounds like undead do right? I lose a wond for every point I loose CR by? If that is true wouldn't I be better off to spend points on a unit of sarus to beat their way through zombies or skellies rather then 4 swarms?
 
A unit of saurus would be more effective at pushing through zombies, but keep in mind that zombies are meant to be sponges for wounds. In my opinion sending in a unit of saurus would be playing to the VC player's benefit because that leaves one of your strongest core units stuck fighting one his expendable units for several turns of the game (dont they have chance to rez too?). Also your saurus would then become extremely vulnerable to flanking. And then keep in mind a unit of saurus only gets one rank of attacks (unless you equip w/ spears but then think of pt differences between say 16 saurus w/ spears and his cheap a*% zombie unit) With a front line of 6 X2 u get X attacks as opposed to X with 4 swarms at the same weapon skill. Although the swarms lack the strength of saurus, the extra 2S would be a overkill against zombies. I don't know the stats of zombies off the top of my head but I believed they hit and wound swarms on a 5+. My point is to utilize swarms as a temporary wound sink so you can focus on your opponents more important units especially magic users. In my opinion saurus are just way to important and expensive to get stuck fighting zombies all game. You can try it by don't say I didn't warn you :P

oops Im not supposed to post stats Ill go back and mark with x's XD
 
Well 5 attacks per base, with ws 3 s2 plus poision attacks hit zombies on 3's wounds on 4's, and didn't get my new codex but don't really think a unit of 5 or 4 or so Swarms cost as much as a Saurus unit does, and can dish out at least 20 attacks or more! so that combat 4 or 5 static, goes to about -4 or so, with the attacks and them being posion,

Zombies (being a VC player too) are tar pits. They are meant for you to take bait, and get stuck for about 3 or 4 turns. Also be careful with some combos, me and my friend were fighting, not too long ago, I charged 40 zombies and Corpse Cart, should've flanked with my Vampire on Skeletons against his 12 chosen Chaos, which by overwhelming him and good amount of hits and making his unit strike at Initiative 1 would have been great for me and he would've been killed.

So watch out for the Zombie Bait!
 
Swarms cost 33% less then before. Do the math ;)
 
Well sorry don't even have the book, Just got into Lizardmen again, but someone I know has the old book.
 
Well, can post you the stat, but they'r identical except from the lower cost so you can tell, They're absolutely improved :)
 
Kingin said:
Well sorry don't even have the book, Just got into Lizardmen again, but someone I know has the old book.
Click to expand...

No need to be sorry for anything mate. We are just trying to inform :D
 
Thanks, nice I am defiantly taking a unit of 5 or so in this 2000 Tournament coming up, the store i go to usally plays 2250.

Oh do you guys use the GW Swarms? Is there another way to convert them instead of green stuff? Know it should be in painting n such were just here n all quick answer lol.
 
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