8th Ed. horde saurus?

[shahryar]

Has anyOne tried it was thinking a block of 40 in horde mode

 

[Arli]

The problem with horde units is that they are too unwieldy. Unless you face another horde unit, those extra attacks will be lost. If you want to run a hord unit, take 40 or 50 saurus, run them 6 wide by 8 or 9 ranks. Then If you get the frontage, reform them into the horde formation.

I watched a game today with two horde units of Chaos warriors. One unit was trapped behind a house and another unit and could not charge because he had no room. That is a major problem with a Horde with 40mm bases. If you have the room, go for it.

 

[Grant]

I do not use a horde because I have played against them often enough to know how much a liability a 10-wide unit is. They're incredibly easy to block up with cheap little units, and even if they eat a diverting unit nearly every turn, they don't make their points back. They need to hit something important, which is rather hard for them to do against a good opponent.

 

[walach]

i'm not entirely convinced by this theory, but it was said to me, it's probably not worth hording anything with more than 1 attack. maybe...

eitherways, i'm not convinced by hordes. i've played against the VC's GG horde, the WoC marauder horde, and killed both. (though admittedly the tzeentch chosen horde is pretty fricking scary!)

 

[Coatl]

the statement of making its points back always confuses me with the current rule set. granted, you would like a return on your investment for all those points you put into that horde, but if its chewing up units every turn, thats a GOOD thing. VP only apply for destroyed units. so not only did your horde kill a couple hundred (easy number for a big game), it didn't give up any points, and thats the importing part (assuming it makes it the whole game of course). for this reason i run a block of 60 saurus in 3k games, stick a slann in there (lore depends on the game but ive done fire, life, death, and heavens i believe) and cast until my opponent gets desperate and tries to take the slann out. 60 saurus with spears and command is 750 exact, and while it rarely makes that back, ive yet to lose more than 40 (still got 20 left ) personally i love that staying power. lets me use them as an anchor in the middle and run my sallies and steggies anywhere i see fit. 2 attacks can be a waste, but i prefer the extra 10 attacks to not having them at all.

 

[huttlord]

I don't think I would horde saurus. That's a big footprint on the field. If I run hordes, it's usually in dwarfs or another 20mm army. I do agree with Coatl as far as units making their points back goes. The unit doesn't need to make its points back. It just needs to make some points and not die. Sometimes a unit doesn't even need to do that. If you take a 750 point sink unit and still have enough other units that can get kills, then the point sink unit can just be point denial and not really have to do anything at all.

 

[JohnMavrick]

I've never seen hordes work. We have a guy who regularly runs a Giant Rat horde with the champion upgrade that gives special stuff to the uni (poison, regen, extra attacks). I've killed it off in the first round of combat every time I play him. Even with the staying power of 4+ regen I've hit his flanks with heavy hitters and put a small unit with minimum frontage into his front and he couldn't get all his attacks in. Died on the spot.

Hordes are a waste of time. I'd much rather have ranks and get stubborn.

 

[Coatl]

60 saurus horde formation has 6 ranks, thats not too shabby. and please dont compare saurus to rats, thats just wrong . point denial ftw!

 

[JohnMavrick]

haha, that's true enough! Giant rats (or any rats) and saurus should never be compaired except where the rat meets a saurus' obsidian blade!

But in all seriousness it could simply be the group that I game with. Everyone prefers to go with multiple ranks rather than horde and I think that's why horde doesn't do as well. If everyone is only five wide and you take a horde unit your loosing attacks on the flank simply because they can't reach. But if you can get your horde stuck into multiple units or against another horde (with support units on the side to aid in turn 2 of combat) then I can see where they would really come in their own.

Just a side thought. Take your huge 60 Saurus unit and put Gor Rok in it. He automatically confers stubborn to the unit so you'll have that even if your opponent out-ranks you.

 

[Coatl]

ill be doing that with my scar vet deathstar. 5 scar vets and gor-rok instead of 6 scar vets. should work out lovely

 

[KroxigorsFTW]

ill be doing that with my scar vet deathstar. 5 scar vets and gor-rok instead of 6 scar vets. should work out lovely

Lore.... Of..... Beasts.... That.... Thing.....

 

[Coatl]

oooo i will sir. 2 slann, one with life in the deathstar, the other with beasts hovering around outside.

 

[lord karnik]

I ran a 7 wide 45 unit of Saurus VS DE and it was mint. With stood some breath hell from a black dragon (twice) and the 3 units of 30 reapeters. Had a Old blood in it.

My typical 3000pt set up is 44 Saurus, spears. 26 Temple guard. Then I place my oldblood in the saurus and the slann in the temple gaurd. Then after looking at what is across the board I place my scar vet in one of the two units. Has been a nices set up.

Ohh and always make the saurus stubburn with the Crown, two stubburn blocks are amazing

 

[KroxigorsFTW]

oooo i will sir. 2 slann, one with life in the deathstar, the other with beasts hovering around outside.

Good, that will tear straight through, well, anything, really. Even Wyssan's is amazing with Saurus.

 

[SanDiegoSurrealist]

I see the biggest problem for a Horde of Saurus is things like Pit of Shades and Dwellers. Nothing like having to make 60 Initiative tests on a 1; laws of averages say you will not be happy with the results.

 

[KroxigorsFTW]

I see the biggest problem for a Horde of Saurus is things like Pit of Shades and Dwellers. Nothing like having to make 60 Initiative tests on a 1; laws of averages say you will not be happy with the results.

I'm so happy I don't need to worry about those.
We have no Power Scroll where I am, and with a Slann with Becalming, it's impossible to IF. So if you really want, you can stop IF, and use scrolls/normal dispelling to fix the rest.
And please, Dwellers? We laugh at Dwellers!

 

[no1cafe]

The largest Saurus unit I would run would be 30 any more just seems like a waste and would do the same as 30. As for hording them it would depend on the enemy since there are times going 5x6 or 6x5 for ranks is better. Horde formation is something you shouldn't force yourself to stick to, adjust formations to best fit the situation, use musicians to swift reform and use the combat reform rules.

I find Saurus work well in 20-25's any more seem redundant though that is what works with my kind of list.

 

[SanDiegoSurrealist]

We have no Power Scroll where I am, and with a Slann with Becalming, it's impossible to IF.

Don't understand what you mean when you say "We have no Power Scroll where I am" did you mean Power Stones? Or do you have a different set of rules than the rest of us?

You can only have 1 dispel scroll.

And Becalming only works on 1 caster and only if he is within 24", so not a 100% guarantee of anything really.

 

[lord karnik]

I used to agree that 30 was plenty but so often it would jsut not hold up in combat. especially agianst beast which I play very often. Mino's with a hero seem to run right through 30 of them but 45 gives you an extra turn or 2 to get into a flank or set up your army for the remainder ofthe game.

 

[Grant]

We have no Power Scroll where I am, and with a Slann with Becalming, it's impossible to IF.

Don't understand what you mean when you say "We have no Power Scroll where I am" did you mean Power Stones? Or do you have a different set of rules than the rest of us?

You can only have 1 dispel scroll.

And Becalming only works on 1 caster and only if he is within 24", so not a 100% guarantee of anything really.

The power scroll is an arcane item in the main rulebook (one use) that makes any doubles on a magic casting count as irresistible force (and miscast). Use the power scroll and 6 dice and you're pretty much guaranteed to get off the spell.