8th Ed. HELP provide a points cost for my custom Chaos Lord, Lady Valentia!

[NIGHTBRINGER]

Much like my previous two custom characters, Ra'nubis and Akamun, I come to you to help me calculate a fair points cost for my latest custom character. This time around the focus switches to my Warriors of Chaos, and their newest Slaaneshi Chaos Lord Lady, Valentia.

Just as before, here is the context:

The goal is to points her in such a way that he is a strong and worthwhile choice (not broken like a Throgg but far from worthless like a Chakax). One should feel confident to put her in a list because she is a powerful addition, but not guilty for fear of her being broken.

In terms of Lizardmen characters: if Chakax is a "1" and Tetto'eko is a "10" in terms of the their power level to points ratio, I'm aiming for an "8".

Voting in the poll gives me a very helpful approximation. If you vote in the poll and then post a message with an exact points total that is even better. And if you are feeling up to it, doing the above and posting a breakdown of your calculated points value is best of all! That said, any help that you can provide would be greatly appreciated!!!

I've completed what I hope is a thorough points calculation myself (and even gave Google Gemini a try at it), but before posting it in the thread, I'd like to hear what all of you have to say independent of my own (hopefully not too biased) calculations.

@Killer Angel @Lord Agragax of Lunaxoatl @Imrahil @Scalenex @Krox_v.2 @hardyworld @airjamy @BrotherSutek @Kblock @Warden @Karnus @WildColonial Boy @Lord-Marcus @Neersh @Padre @Lizards of Renown and anyone else I may have missed.

Without further ado, here is Valentia's rules (if for whatever reason the forum doesn't let you see the image, let me know and I will manually write them out as text):

 

[NIGHTBRINGER]

 

[Killer Angel]

View attachment 174508

I hope you're not in a hurry, 'cause I'm gonna take my time with this

 

[NIGHTBRINGER]

I hope you're not in a hurry, 'cause I'm gonna take my time with this

I look forward to it. Your great insights will be worth the wait!

 

[Scalenex]

60 points, it's Warriors of Chaos in 8th edition, everything has to be undercosted.

 

[NIGHTBRINGER]

60 points, it's Warriors of Chaos in 8th edition, everything has to be undercosted.

Not everything, but I get your meaning!


Jokes aside, do you have a real points value for me? I know you haven't really involved yourself in the gaming aspect of the forum for a while, but your input would be helpful!

 

[Scalenex]

I've played Warriors of Chaos a lot and I've only won once.

The game I did win had a lot of unusual mitigating factors. It was an Invasion Scenario and I was using the Lore of Undeath so the game was very unorthodox. The Lore of Undeath is very powerful in a scenario when you get victory points for having units to occupy or contest quarters of the board.

Jokes aside, do you have a real points value for me? I know you haven't really involved yourself in the gaming aspect of the forum for a while, but your input would be helpful!

Her base stat line is roughly equal to a Dark Elf Dread Lord. I'd use that as the baseline. I don't know where my Dark Elf book is so I can't look that up. 100 maybe.

I would say her magic weapons are roughly equivalent to a runefang in power. Not quite as good at doing damage but with an extra attack.

Figure out what it cost to give a Tzeentch character a 3+ ward save, then add 10 points to that because Slaanesh are not normally supposed to have Ward saves that good.

I'd guestimate the "She Who Thirsts" rule is about 25 points.

The Allure of the Dark Prince is a really potent. It means she has a huge edge in a challenge and spamming her with normal unit attacks is likely to backfire. Given that her magic weapons and high Weapon Skill, and Always Strikes First (so she is rerolling most misses), a bonus attack is practically a free wound. I'd guestimate it is about 50, the same as a Vampire's Red Fury.

Speaking of Always Strikes First, she has Initiative 10. That basically means she rerolls every attack. Most of the time she is hitting on 3s. So that 8 out of 9 of her attacks will hit most opponents. That's worth at least 100 points in my book.

Heroic Killing Blow is extremely powerful. A little bit redundant given that she practically never misses and ignores armor saves, but this makes her deadly against enemy characters and great at killing monster. I'd throw 50 points on for that.

Strength 4 is pretty weak for a Chaos character BUT since one of the main benefit of having high strength is bypassing armor saves and she ignores armor saves, this weakness is more than covered. Also, Heroic Killing Blow partially makes up for her relative shortcoming in slicing up high toughness opponents because if she rolls a 6, her enemy dies. With six attacks per round, that means statistically she will kill any opponent once per combat. So no bonus points for that "weakness"

She only has a 6+ armor save which is basically no armor save, and Toughness 4 is nothing to write home about but WS10, Initiative 10 and Always Strikes First, and a 3+ Ward, landing a hit is going to very difficult. So no bonus points for that "weakness".

I imagine fighting her would be a lot like fighting a souped up Vampire Count. The Vampire provides the bulk of the combat resolution and the unit he is with is mostly there to provide a buffer against shooting.

EXCEPT I'm going to guess that 90% of the time she is fielded, she will be leading a unit of Chaos Warriors with the Mark of Slaanesh. Unlike the undead units Vampire Counts lead, Chaos Warriors are tough nuts to crack. Unless the enemy is also Chaos Warriors (which would be a fun battle to watch!), her unit will basically never lose a CR ever. I'd add 25 points to the pile for that synergy.

Adding all that together, I would call that the low end of her points value.

I'd consider boosting 10% to 50% beyond that because every special ability and magic item she has synergizes very well.

I didn't put a whole lot of thought into, this was just spit balling off the top of my head. That's my process anyway. Find the nearest baseline among characters that already exist and add or remove points based on differences.

Other than Tet and Maz, I'm not a big fan of Lizardmen special characters. Maybe this is a flawed strategy on my part but when I equip my general and BSB in any army, not just Lizardmen, I tend to prioritize armor and ward saves over anything else.

It bugs me that most Empire special characters have a one-handed melee weapon and no shield. Not only does it make no sense, but shields provide cool painting opportunities though probably doesn't apply to Lady Valentia.