Saurus
Stormfrog
New Member
- Messages
- 91
- Likes Received
- 48
- Trophy Points
- 0
Right then!
This past weekend I attended my first ever tournament with the new Lizardmen here in Sweden. Worth mentioning that I had actually only played two previous games against a friend with my new lizardmen army beforhand. I thought i'd give my rough impressions of the units, synergies and magic that I used during the event, in the hope that someone might be interested.
I finished 10th in the rankings (90-ish participants), and it was only an insanely unlucky miscast (Dimensional cascade on two dice soul quench) during the final stages of the last match that kept me from placing 3'rd or 2'nd. Argh!
We played under the Swedish comp system, with a minimum comp of 15.0 (For those of you who knows what that means), and we were playing with open lists for a change.
My list was as follows:
Slaan
- General
- BSB
- Focus of mystery
- Ironcurse icon
- Scroll of shielding
- Obsidian Lodestone
- Razor banner
Scar- Veteran
- Light armor
- Spear
- Charmed shield
- Talisman of preservation
- Carnosaur with swiftstride
Skink chief
- Light armor
- spear
- Enchanted shield
- Egg of quango
28 x Saurus
- FC
3x10 Skirmishers
- 2 with blowpipes, 1 with javs
2x10 cohorts
- Musician
28 x Templeguard
- FC
3 x Rippertactyls (Under the swedish ruling, a chief mounted on a ripper may join this unit)
Ancient stegadon
Total of 2400 pts
So, the review of my lizardmen.
Slaan
Even with my limited amount of cheesy upgrades in the way of channeling staff + harmonic convergence etc, he was still a powerhouse of magic. Loremastery of high magic made him incredibly versatile, and I had reason to be thankfull for his relativly (for a wizard) good defences. I did have some stupid luck with miscasts during the tournament though, with an avarage of 1-2 miscasts during each match (one even had 3!). And as such, I must really consider the soul of stone in the future, especially with a temple guard bunker. Did miss a skink priest to bounce magic missiles of though.
Scar-vet on a carnosaur
That carnosaurs are uncompetetive is a common phrase that is parroted by many people. After this tournament however, I must say I am firmly planted in ZaGreekie's camp of Carnosaur lovin'. He was without a doubt one of my WIP for the tournament, even though I faced a total of 5 warmachines during the event. By using the terrain, combined with walk between the worlds, this guy is a horror to many things that most Lizardmen lists lack hard counters against. During the tournament, he most notably slaughtered a unit of 5 Mournfangs, a unit of 5 ogres, bit the head of a high elf prince riding a star dragon, munched a stonehorn, ripped apart a chimera with all the uppgrades, and a variety of other things. Local meta is naturaly a factor in using him, but I strongly urge people to give him a go, for he is both fun to use, and in my experience, devastating! (Not to mention the look of the model).
Chief on a ripperdactyl & Ripperdactyl unit
These guys were a little hit-and-miss. They have a very specific target choice, and lacking them, they struggle to find a nische. In general though, I felt that they were worth taking, partly due to the psychological factor (which often led them to being destroyed by magic missiles, or, in one case, a star dragon
), but also because they really did their points worth of kills on a number of occasions. The frenzy, as so many people keep crying about due to their low leadership, I found to not be an issue whatsoever. They are fliers with free re-forms. I allways turned them away from the enemy unless I was either sure to get the charge I wanted, or had the Slaan to restrain my charge. If you are getting unwanted charges with your rippers on a regular basis, then you are not using them correctly. I had rotten luck with the Egg of Quango though, barely causing half a dozen wounds during the entire tournament, but that is due to my awfull dice, rather then any inherent flaw with the item itself.
Saurus
These guys were the underperformers of the army. They often either did nothing, barely nothing, or got ganged up on by a host of things that did not dare take on my temple guard, and subsequently destroyed. The only match where they actually did quite alot, it was due to one very bad dice-roll of my opponent (Allowing my saurus to catch and destroy a unit of doomfire warlocks, containing his sorceress and supreme sorceress general at the time). I still firmly belive in the Saurus, and I just think I either was to cowardly in their use, or simply faced the wrong opposition.
Skinks in general
The true heavy lifters of the lizardmen army. Would never leave home without atleast 5 units of them in the future, and preferably more. They re-direct, shoot like crazy, prevent charges and are a general pain in the neck for every opponent I faced. The number of uses you can put skinks to is truly amazing. Their LD 5 was noticable on a few occasions, but I tried my best to keep them close to the slaan as much as possible, which was a little tricky to do and allow them to perform their task at the same time. A general principle I can recoment if you have loads of skinks/chamos, is to send them in waves of perhaps 3 units at the time, have them shoot, flee, then send in the next wave, shoot, flee, and then the skinks from the previous wave will have rallied due to fleeing in the proximity of your slaans high leadership and BSB. This works wonders for hampering and whittling down a truly nasty enemy unit while you smash the rest of his army (did this to irongut deathstars twice while I took care of the rest of the army).
Temple guard
To be honest, these guys are monsters. They did not see as much combat as you would expect perhaps, but when they did, the ripped it apart. The only time they failed and got destroyed, along with the Slaan, was against a unit of great weapon wielding khorne warriors and a juggernaut BSB where they fluffed ALL their attacks and got hammered. I got the distinct impression that people are truly afraid to tangle with the temple guard, and so avoid it at almost all costs (often to their costs as I found out). They do have the drawback of suffering greatly for the Slaan's miscasts, and I think I killed more templeguard myself than my opponents did to be honest. I found Razor banner to be a must have for them though, as it greatly helps mitigate their lack of streangth 6. Hand of glory + Wyssans combo on these turns them into something I doubt anything in the game can take head on, as they wiped out a unit of 4 crushers in only one round of combat with these buffs, without rolling stupendously well.
Ancient stegadon
Another one of my WIP's. While he performed decently in true close combat, his real value was as a psycological threat and (suprisingly) using his blowpipes. Two of my opponents confessed to being quite scared of the lumbering brute, and he is excellent at holding a flank free from chaff (with blowpipes) and most any flank chargers there are, due to having stupid amounts of toughness, armor and stubborn to boot. During the entire event, he only got killed once, which was due to an unlucky charge against a unit of chaos warriors (He got in alone, had planned for the carnosaur to get in alongside him) but still tied them up for three combat rounds. The ancient stegadon will be a common staple in my armies in the future, as he truly deserves it. (especially after shooting a phoenix of the table in a single round. 7 poison hits and 2 normal wounds? Seriously?)
High Magic
I found high magic loremastery to be quite alright. It allows for loads of versatility, and hand of glory, walk between the worlds, arcane unforging and soul quench are all truly great spells. I never faced one of the great big ugly units where fiery conflegration was really worth the risk of casting it compared to soul quench though, but this is mostly due to meta I belive. One issue I have with it is the relativly short ranges of its offensive spells, which often leaves you with not much to do during the opening stages of the game (although this is also due to the lack of a priest to bounce spells of), other than casting drain magic and tempest in the attempt to get searing doom (wanted this almost every game) and Wyssans (the same). These factors combined grants me the vague suspicion that Wandering deliberations might perhaps be the better choice. It gives you ready access to these spells that I belive are so vital in the current meta of high armor and toughness, but also means you are not wasting the first one or two magic rounds trying to partly get hold of the spells you want, and actually use the high magic spells you want to keep (WBW, Unforging etc). I plan on using deliberations during a smaller tournament in January to try it out, but I will truly miss high magic versus elves and those damn unkillable Tzeentch Chaos lords (Arcane unforging + searing doom destroys them!).
Thats it for me, and I must say as a closing line that I am truly pleased with the new Lizardmen book. It has its flaws, granted, but on the whole I find it to be an engaging book with loads of options and fun builds. The rankings of the tournament attested to the books solid nature, with the avarage ranking of lizardmen players being 25th place (out of 90-ish players), and there being alot of difference between the various lizardmen lists, with Troglodons, Bastiladons, Carnosaurs, both stegs, rippers and razordons all being represented.
This past weekend I attended my first ever tournament with the new Lizardmen here in Sweden. Worth mentioning that I had actually only played two previous games against a friend with my new lizardmen army beforhand. I thought i'd give my rough impressions of the units, synergies and magic that I used during the event, in the hope that someone might be interested.
I finished 10th in the rankings (90-ish participants), and it was only an insanely unlucky miscast (Dimensional cascade on two dice soul quench) during the final stages of the last match that kept me from placing 3'rd or 2'nd. Argh!
We played under the Swedish comp system, with a minimum comp of 15.0 (For those of you who knows what that means), and we were playing with open lists for a change.
My list was as follows:
Slaan
- General
- BSB
- Focus of mystery
- Ironcurse icon
- Scroll of shielding
- Obsidian Lodestone
- Razor banner
Scar- Veteran
- Light armor
- Spear
- Charmed shield
- Talisman of preservation
- Carnosaur with swiftstride
Skink chief
- Light armor
- spear
- Enchanted shield
- Egg of quango
28 x Saurus
- FC
3x10 Skirmishers
- 2 with blowpipes, 1 with javs
2x10 cohorts
- Musician
28 x Templeguard
- FC
3 x Rippertactyls (Under the swedish ruling, a chief mounted on a ripper may join this unit)
Ancient stegadon
Total of 2400 pts
So, the review of my lizardmen.
Slaan
Even with my limited amount of cheesy upgrades in the way of channeling staff + harmonic convergence etc, he was still a powerhouse of magic. Loremastery of high magic made him incredibly versatile, and I had reason to be thankfull for his relativly (for a wizard) good defences. I did have some stupid luck with miscasts during the tournament though, with an avarage of 1-2 miscasts during each match (one even had 3!). And as such, I must really consider the soul of stone in the future, especially with a temple guard bunker. Did miss a skink priest to bounce magic missiles of though.
Scar-vet on a carnosaur
That carnosaurs are uncompetetive is a common phrase that is parroted by many people. After this tournament however, I must say I am firmly planted in ZaGreekie's camp of Carnosaur lovin'. He was without a doubt one of my WIP for the tournament, even though I faced a total of 5 warmachines during the event. By using the terrain, combined with walk between the worlds, this guy is a horror to many things that most Lizardmen lists lack hard counters against. During the tournament, he most notably slaughtered a unit of 5 Mournfangs, a unit of 5 ogres, bit the head of a high elf prince riding a star dragon, munched a stonehorn, ripped apart a chimera with all the uppgrades, and a variety of other things. Local meta is naturaly a factor in using him, but I strongly urge people to give him a go, for he is both fun to use, and in my experience, devastating! (Not to mention the look of the model).
Chief on a ripperdactyl & Ripperdactyl unit
These guys were a little hit-and-miss. They have a very specific target choice, and lacking them, they struggle to find a nische. In general though, I felt that they were worth taking, partly due to the psychological factor (which often led them to being destroyed by magic missiles, or, in one case, a star dragon
), but also because they really did their points worth of kills on a number of occasions. The frenzy, as so many people keep crying about due to their low leadership, I found to not be an issue whatsoever. They are fliers with free re-forms. I allways turned them away from the enemy unless I was either sure to get the charge I wanted, or had the Slaan to restrain my charge. If you are getting unwanted charges with your rippers on a regular basis, then you are not using them correctly. I had rotten luck with the Egg of Quango though, barely causing half a dozen wounds during the entire tournament, but that is due to my awfull dice, rather then any inherent flaw with the item itself.Saurus
These guys were the underperformers of the army. They often either did nothing, barely nothing, or got ganged up on by a host of things that did not dare take on my temple guard, and subsequently destroyed. The only match where they actually did quite alot, it was due to one very bad dice-roll of my opponent (Allowing my saurus to catch and destroy a unit of doomfire warlocks, containing his sorceress and supreme sorceress general at the time). I still firmly belive in the Saurus, and I just think I either was to cowardly in their use, or simply faced the wrong opposition.
Skinks in general
The true heavy lifters of the lizardmen army. Would never leave home without atleast 5 units of them in the future, and preferably more. They re-direct, shoot like crazy, prevent charges and are a general pain in the neck for every opponent I faced. The number of uses you can put skinks to is truly amazing. Their LD 5 was noticable on a few occasions, but I tried my best to keep them close to the slaan as much as possible, which was a little tricky to do and allow them to perform their task at the same time. A general principle I can recoment if you have loads of skinks/chamos, is to send them in waves of perhaps 3 units at the time, have them shoot, flee, then send in the next wave, shoot, flee, and then the skinks from the previous wave will have rallied due to fleeing in the proximity of your slaans high leadership and BSB. This works wonders for hampering and whittling down a truly nasty enemy unit while you smash the rest of his army (did this to irongut deathstars twice while I took care of the rest of the army).
Temple guard
To be honest, these guys are monsters. They did not see as much combat as you would expect perhaps, but when they did, the ripped it apart. The only time they failed and got destroyed, along with the Slaan, was against a unit of great weapon wielding khorne warriors and a juggernaut BSB where they fluffed ALL their attacks and got hammered. I got the distinct impression that people are truly afraid to tangle with the temple guard, and so avoid it at almost all costs (often to their costs as I found out). They do have the drawback of suffering greatly for the Slaan's miscasts, and I think I killed more templeguard myself than my opponents did to be honest. I found Razor banner to be a must have for them though, as it greatly helps mitigate their lack of streangth 6. Hand of glory + Wyssans combo on these turns them into something I doubt anything in the game can take head on, as they wiped out a unit of 4 crushers in only one round of combat with these buffs, without rolling stupendously well.
Ancient stegadon
Another one of my WIP's. While he performed decently in true close combat, his real value was as a psycological threat and (suprisingly) using his blowpipes. Two of my opponents confessed to being quite scared of the lumbering brute, and he is excellent at holding a flank free from chaff (with blowpipes) and most any flank chargers there are, due to having stupid amounts of toughness, armor and stubborn to boot. During the entire event, he only got killed once, which was due to an unlucky charge against a unit of chaos warriors (He got in alone, had planned for the carnosaur to get in alongside him) but still tied them up for three combat rounds. The ancient stegadon will be a common staple in my armies in the future, as he truly deserves it. (especially after shooting a phoenix of the table in a single round. 7 poison hits and 2 normal wounds? Seriously?)
High Magic
I found high magic loremastery to be quite alright. It allows for loads of versatility, and hand of glory, walk between the worlds, arcane unforging and soul quench are all truly great spells. I never faced one of the great big ugly units where fiery conflegration was really worth the risk of casting it compared to soul quench though, but this is mostly due to meta I belive. One issue I have with it is the relativly short ranges of its offensive spells, which often leaves you with not much to do during the opening stages of the game (although this is also due to the lack of a priest to bounce spells of), other than casting drain magic and tempest in the attempt to get searing doom (wanted this almost every game) and Wyssans (the same). These factors combined grants me the vague suspicion that Wandering deliberations might perhaps be the better choice. It gives you ready access to these spells that I belive are so vital in the current meta of high armor and toughness, but also means you are not wasting the first one or two magic rounds trying to partly get hold of the spells you want, and actually use the high magic spells you want to keep (WBW, Unforging etc). I plan on using deliberations during a smaller tournament in January to try it out, but I will truly miss high magic versus elves and those damn unkillable Tzeentch Chaos lords (Arcane unforging + searing doom destroys them!).
Thats it for me, and I must say as a closing line that I am truly pleased with the new Lizardmen book. It has its flaws, granted, but on the whole I find it to be an engaging book with loads of options and fun builds. The rankings of the tournament attested to the books solid nature, with the avarage ranking of lizardmen players being 25th place (out of 90-ish players), and there being alot of difference between the various lizardmen lists, with Troglodons, Bastiladons, Carnosaurs, both stegs, rippers and razordons all being represented.
(or have special rules about line of sight)