7th Ed. EotG, how do you guys use it?

[SiegeCommander]

Would you all agree that it's greatest weakness is that little t2 priest on top? If you want the engine to do anything other than hang back and boost magic and provide ward saves you gotta move it up close. Getting up close to use the burning alignment means exposing the little guy on top to possible cc, where a lone chaos warrior can casually walk up and destroy your wizard and his big toy (the ability to direct cc attacks at the character instead). How do you guys deploy/use the stegadon given this big risk.

 

[Revered_Guardian]

basically. I take him with the rest of my army warding them, when teh enemy army comes close, I charge forwards by either marching (yay!) to the middle of his side, or, charging a weak unit, and then spam the alignment

Best alignment ever...

HAHA! my silver helms are coming to kill that stegadon!

BZZ!!!! *out of 10 of em, 6 of them flee away alive*

and thats not including all the goblins that died that day!

 

[SiegeCommander]

I've certainly had epic times like that, I remember I once wiped out a unit of dragon princes with the burning alignment, but I've also had time where I roll 1's and 2's for the d6 hits (on two units of skirmishing skinks)

 

[DonkeyHotep]

Amulet of Itzl.... it does wonders for the guy riding the things, especially if something dumb like a cannon (warp lightning or otherwise) happens to bean this guy. The skink priest may be T 2, but he does have a 2+ armor save, and his mount is str 6, which can ruin people's day in a challenge. One thing you may need to worry about is pulling yourself out of combat when you charge and align. Flank charge some cavalry, and do 2 wounds, they have to pull from both sides, getting the steg out of combat. Often this can leave you sitting out in the open like a jackass to get cannoned or something.

My friends and I usually refer to the engine powers as "gungan bubble", "the fire spell", and nothing, since that last ability to cheapen a lore hasn't been used in... like... forever.

 

[lustria2009]

Deployment and Movement are key. More than key, if either are poor, you're doomed.

I've played EoTG a few times and have only ever charged one time. The others i've either been avoided or been charged myself.

I am of course a rookie and am learning, but it has been disapointing to me so far.

The war drum seems very helpful. Basically grants the ability to always march.

I'm running two in the upcoming Hard Boys tourney and i plan to run them together between my blocks of saurus. Hopefully the blocks protect the flanks and it allows me to choose when to charge. We'll see.

I don't expect great things at the tourny being new and all. I just hope to face three new people and three different armies.

 

[strewart]

My friends and I usually refer to the engine powers as "gungan bubble", "the fire spell", and nothing, since that last ability to cheapen a lore hasn't been used in... like... forever.

Yes my first thought of the engine was relating it to the Gungan Fambaas who carry those huge shield generators.

Anyway, exactly right the t2 priest is the weak point and the key to stopping an engine. It is best to keep him safe early in the game, running him just behind your lines is fine. Remember, when your line is in combat he is pretty close to the action, then you can start to pew pew as Donkey would say. Make sure he stays covered by terrain if possible in turn 1/2 while you tie up or destroy those nasty warmachines.

 

[SlannOfItza]

I'm still pretty new to the 7th edition lizardmen, and so I've only run one battle with a double EoTG. I learned later thats a bit cheesy with a slann as well, but I digress. And after playing with em and reading alot I've seen them do wonders with the wardrums of xahutec.

If your smart you can get cose enough to then start marching around an enemy unit, remaining out of their charge arc. You can march and use the burning alignment, so I just circle a block of troops, potentially charging the flank or rear if they ignore the engine and charge one of my saurus blocks or whatever.

Against cavalry its easy enough to screen and redirect, then circle them with wardrums again. Terradon riders with feigned flight makes that simple enough. Before you do that though, I suggest hunting the obvious threats first. Chameleons and terradons at those cannons and bolt throwers, drop rocks on fast cavalry, etc. Then fly back around and protect your EoTG.

They work well to hide inbetween or behind some saurus, once they are in combat walk up right near the enemy and start blasting, helps whittle the enemy in combat with your saurus down. At least thats how I'd use em. Anyway,

Good Luck...

 

[ColdBlood666]

I guess if one were to use one or two EOTG's and maybe one or two regular stegs he could screen the engines the first few rounds as they all advanced as a group. Since monsters movement is pretty relaxed a regular steg could move straight and end its move in a horizontal position and be able to screen two engines if the engines were flush against eachother. Then one engine could use its bubble and the other could use the +1 to cast till they got close enough to fire their deathstar abilities.

I wouldnt use this tactic against armies with multiple template weapons though. Maybe this diagram could help. S means stegadon and E and e means the two engines

SSSS
EEee
EEee

 

[Barotok]

The Engine of the Gods is something of a paradox. You have a T2 magic user, that is mounted on a monster that relishes close combat. To get your points worth from the stegadon you have to get it into combat. To get your points from the priest, you have to stay out of close combat. As you may have guessed from the thread already, most players are using the engine and priest for the first few turns conservatively, utilizing the priests magic and the engine's destructive/protective abilities. After a few turns, when it is safe (which is a relative term), you'll see the steg get into some combat while the engine blasts away with burning alignment. It appears that a good tactic is to give the steg something soft to hit. The hard hit can break it quickly and help keep the priest alive at the top. Also, with proper planning (and some luck from the dice gods) you'll find that the engine adds a huge amount of support to an already strong line-up of support troops that the LM have to utilize.

Effective use of the Engine comes down to deployement and movement. Artillery usually will focus on the largest or most terrifying target on the board and try to take it out early, so correct deployment is very important. Good deployement, sets you up to make good moves in the first couple of critical turns in which you can blast away. If you set your combats up correctly, the engine will be a valuable support for flanks/rear of the enemy.

Practice makes perfect, so the more games you play the more skilled and experienced you'll become at utilizing this tool that the LM army has to offer. Believe me, they're a sight to behold in the hands of an experienced player.

 

[ColdBlood666]

I also think that since most of our dispel dice are wrapped up in the engines and (as the stegadon bestiary implies) if we lose one of them during the battle it could seriously hamper the Old Ones plans and mess up our ability to win the game if going up against a heavy magic army. So I guess what im saying is in a army if your going to take one it would be best to use them in pairs. Kinda like Varghulfs I suppose.

 

[Dumbledore]

If by "best" you mean "more cheesy", then yes, yes it would.

By extension if you are using two, wouldn't it be "best" to take three?

 

[Barotok]

I disagree, using one of these in conjunction with a Slann can make for a lethal combination. If you take a list that drops a bunch of DD into the priests on top of the stegadons, then yes, your magic defense drops significantly after a cannon ball hit. If you use them as an accent to a list that has the potential to be carry 2 roles (hammer & magic) you can use that to your advantage. Fleshing out a ~2k list with another character makes for a very effective magic phase which even the loss of the engine will not entirely cripple.

Or hell, just take 4.

 

[Hodges]

Amulet of Itzl.... it does wonders for the guy riding the things, especially if something dumb like a cannon (warp lightning or otherwise) happens to bean this guy. The skink priest may be T 2, but he does have a 2+ armor save, and his mount is str 6, which can ruin people's day in a challenge. One thing you may need to worry about is pulling yourself out of combat when you charge and align. Flank charge some cavalry, and do 2 wounds, they have to pull from both sides, getting the steg out of combat. Often this can leave you sitting out in the open like a jackass to get cannoned or something.

My friends and I usually refer to the engine powers as "gungan bubble", "the fire spell", and nothing, since that last ability to cheapen a lore hasn't been used in... like... forever.

I like the idea of the Amulet on this guy, increases his survivability a lot. Could be enough to hold up that charging unit long enough to get an Alignment on them the following turn.

What would be better for the points though, the Amulet or the Wardrums?

 

[ColdBlood666]

I think a list with no slaan or old blood but two engines is just fine and wont be "cheesy". Its always the same with lizardmen players. Do I got to go up against a slaan or a carnosaur? I think the list has more capability and can be more flexible without a lord choice at all.

I also dont believe in "cheesy" lists. Its my opinion that if its a legal list its a fair list. The people that cry "cheese" over anothers army probebly are not good players anyways. And who cares. Its a game. Im not in it to win it anyways. My armies look fantastic and win me painting awards at every tournament I play. The people that only care about winning at warhammer are the same nerds playing world of warcraft all day and night while thier real lives are totally neglected.

The main focus should be what your army looks like and if its painted properly. Not if its units are "statistically" sound for game winning. Ive played a hundred kids who got their strategies and army mechanics down so cold that they missed the whole point of the game. Not to mention thier armies usually look like total garbage.

Not every opinion or idea needs to be turned into a debate. Use that energy and go excercise or clean your house or something. Online super egos are laughable and totally ridiculous, and the people that are there to agree with every word they say are leeches on the tit. Mindless followers who crave acknowledgement.

Curse you Dumbledore for your pitiful attempts at aggression. Your a vile bottom feeder.
Thrice cursed are your followers.

 

[kables]

i just want to add my 2 cents here

I purchased a steg about a week ago
today in the 1500 Mighty Empire i ran a priest mounted on a Ancient Steg

set him on the very far right of the table behind my Salamander and Cold ones
and OMG . just wow. he did a great great job

I cant wait to get 2 more.

 

[Barotok]

I would like to take a minute to weigh in on coldBlood666's post. I read through it a few times and ther are quite a few parts that I find pretty scathing. Not withstanding, I feel that it's important to share my opinion in light of the comments that have been made here. Please bear in mind that I will be sharing my view and that while I do not wish to challenge ColdBlood666's opinion, I do wish to challenge his method of delivery. I also don't want to derail the thread's discussion. But I feel that it's pretty much off the track already.

I think a list with no slaan or old blood but two engines is just fine and wont be "cheesy". Its always the same with lizardmen players. Do I got to go up against a slaan or a carnosaur? I think the list has more capability and can be more flexible without a lord choice at all.

However rare this is on the forums amoung the frequent posters on the forums, it is a very valid opinion with some pretty solid facts to back it up. There has been some exploration of lists and tactics not using lord level characters but the core of the discussion found on LO seems centralized around lists with either one (Slann or Old Blood) of them playing some sort of role.

I also dont believe in "cheesy" lists. Its my opinion that if its a legal list its a fair list. The people that cry "cheese" over anothers army probebly are not good players anyways.

Not believing in "cheesy" lists is a perfectly valid opinion as well. I certainly hope that you won't be challenged on that either. As for me, I hold a slightly different view of the game. Because of that I feel that there are certian combinations that can throw the game into extreme imbalance. I would also like to say that the gaming group that I attend all try to run balanced lists. They are all excellent players (some tournament winners) and have no problem letting you know if they think that a list is potentially imbalanced. So, while you may be making a generalization about the skill of 'cheese cryers', there are certainly many cases where this is not the case. Keep in mind that there are very talented warhammer players who have been in the hobby for many years that can cry 'cheese' and it has nothing to do with their play style or skill.

And who cares. Its a game. Im not in it to win it anyways. My armies look fantastic and win me painting awards at every tournament I play. The people that only care about winning at warhammer are the same nerds playing world of warcraft all day and night while thier real lives are totally neglected.

I can also agree with this statement as well! It IS just a game. Have fun, enjoy the aspects of it that you can apprecaite like painting or what ever else. If that wins you awards, thats even better. ColdBlooded666 your next comment really was offensive to me. I am a nerd. I play WoW. You can easily find this out if you've read these forums. I've written a Cheesy Players guide for these forums. I pay my rent on time every month and pay a car payment along with all my other bills every month without a problem. I care about my life and my hobbies. I maintain balance through time management. I'm not a powergamer, and I definitely don't cry when I loose. I can't help but feel singled out, wether you intended it or not. There is nothing wrong with wanting to win. You would do well to keep your comments like that to yourself in the future and while you may not care about winning, you should care about your words.

The main focus should be what your army looks like and if its painted properly. Not if its units are "statistically" sound for game winning. Ive played a hundred kids who got their strategies and army mechanics down so cold that they missed the whole point of the game. Not to mention thier armies usually look like total garbage.

This focus is a very valid focus, but is definitely not the only focus that all warhammer players have. This forum is largely consisted of many individuals who enjoy the discussion of a unit's "statistical soundness" and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. If that's not a huge point for you in the game, no problem. Don't visit the threads that discuss it to make comments. You wouldn't want someone who was a powergamer tossing a post in one of your threads saying that painting doesn't matter at all and that all you need was a the newest army list/or units. I can agree with the fact that some folks put no effort into making their armys look acceptable, but for them that may not be the point of the game. If it is your focus, stick to your focus and don't bug people who don't focus on the same thing.

Not every opinion or idea needs to be turned into a debate. Use that energy and go excercise or clean your house or something. Online super egos are laughable and totally ridiculous, and the people that are there to agree with every word they say are leeches on the tit. Mindless followers who crave acknowledgement.

In case you haven't noticed, this is a forum. It's a place where ideas and opinions are discussed and debated. While I agree that energy (like the kind I'm using to write this post) could be better spent, I don't see much point to your post when stacked up against the original topic either. So why bother posting? Am I missing something here; because I don't see anyone with a 'super ego' in this thread. Why are you making these comments anyways? Leeches on a tit?

Curse you Dumbledore for your pitiful attempts at aggression. Your a vile bottom feeder. Thrice cursed are your followers.

Before this becomes an all out flame war, I'd like to point out that name calling is hardly acceptable. Let's keep focused on the discussion and/or debate and leave this kind of trash for the forums that are visited by the kids who don't put any effort into their painting and cry 'cheese' all the time?


Please don't bother responding to this post either, as I'm not likely to visit this thread or any other that you create again and I'm not interested in flames, namecalling or angry/cynical debate. Thanks.

 

[lupercal]

speaking of name calling

strawart is a champion is a little kiss ass

kidding

i just had to throw that out there

 

[Dreadgrass]

Thank you Barotok, you put into words something I was far too livid about to be able to submit a "forum acceptable" post!

On the topic of EotG Im toying with the idea of a 2K list built around an old blood, 2 scar vets and a purely utility EotG priest with the diadem and a scroll, giving me the bubble and 6 DD, he will hopefully not see combat except against things he can total with impact hits.

The stegs there purely for +1 DD, bubble, protecting the priest, Terror, and the occasional Burning alignment if I can slip him between 2 enemy units, though for the mainstay of the game he'll be plodding along behing the 3 Saurus characters and their Saurus Spear blocks.

I guess what Im saying is that I find his utility roles are sufficient reason to use him, without the need to race into combat and risk the Priest.

 

[strewart]

I also dont believe in "cheesy" lists. Its my opinion that if its a legal list its a fair list. The people that cry "cheese" over anothers army probebly are not good players anyways.

I would agree with this... But I am more inclined to think the opposite actually, and at risk of showing poor etiquette, I'm going to flat out say you are wrong.

My condition of agreeing with you is IF GW actually playtested the lists extensively, and tried almost every different combination to see what works and what doesn't and how powerful things match up. The simple fact is that they don't; in fact for a while (ironically, around the time of VC) they ditched playtesting all together. Now it can be almost impossible to come up with everything that everyone who tries to squeeze the maximum out of the book will think of, the solution is to update and make changes if they see things as overpowered. Have a living rulebook if you will, like the very balance specialist games have.

This does not happen. The people who write the books are far more interested in a fun game, playing 'fair', enjoying it. Thats fine, nothing wrong there. The problem is, they don't care so much about balance because they play fair anyway. Just look at a few battle reports in White Dwarf; the lists and tactics are absolute rubbish but both players have fun which is their aim. For the people who look to exploit everything in the book, to make their army as powerful as possible without thinking at all about models or fluff they like, it makes the game quite unbalanced. This is fact, some army lists simple are a lot more powerful than others. Until the books see constant real updates and lots more playtesting it will continue to be this way.

Sure there are people that cry cheese every time they lose when the problem is their own tactics not the opponent's army, and they are simply in the wrong hobby. These are the people you are annoyed at I believe.

Curse you Dumbledore for your pitiful attempts at aggression. Your a vile bottom feeder.
Thrice cursed are your followers.

And that kind of stuff can stay right off the forum. This is absolutely not a matter of opinion. Everyone is welcome to their opinion as long as they do it with respect to everyone else.

Also,

speaking of name calling

strawart is a champion is a little kiss ass

kidding

i just had to throw that out there

That actually started entirely as a joke, and I still consider it a joke as I'm sure Baratok does. Maybe I should add the link to my sig as well...

 

[Barotok]

Kiss ass? I was thinking this a while back actually. However, since Strewart doesn't have the link I decided to provide it.

New members who've done any kind of reading on previous threads will easily recognize the thread considering how many times it's been the victim of "thread necromancy". The joke started in Revered Guardians on the first page.

Here's your link Strewart:
http://www.lustria-online.com/threads/revered-guardians.1715/