AoS EoTG Cosmic Engine

[emee]

in one of my last games i had a question regarding the EoTG. i tried to find an answer using the search function before but failed.


(6-9) An enemy unit within 25" is hit with a bolt of azure energy that shoots from the engine, suffering D6 mortal wounds.


nothing unusal so far. that game my enemy tried to hide his enemy hero behind a rock, so he was not in the line of sight. he argued that a "bolt" of anything follows the same path like the los. so i cannot see his model and not beeing able to target his model.
i argued that in the text there is no restriction for picking enemy targets. there's a couple of rules that exactly describe that they need a los to work. f.e. some aqshy spells. (and maybe the allmighty Engine of The Gods knows exactly where his little unclean followers hide and just crush through anything to fullfil the wishes of the Slann or my troops are skilled enough to shoot bolts around corners )

well its not 100% cleared out so far and i would like to know more about. i did not see further rules explanations.

thanks for your help

 

[Aginor]

All spells and abilities requiring line of sight say so.
Unless there is a core mechanic that explains that you have to have line of sight, then it is vice versa (for example shooting).

It is an engine of the GODS. Do Gods need line of sight?
The fluff text also says that it can disrupt the natural laws of the universe.
The bolt might just shoot around the rock, or right through it. It might shoot toward the sky in a steep ballistic arc and hit from straight above.

 

[emee]

that is what i expected. i won the roll off that match and grilled that character hiding behind the wall anyway

but wth they dont just write: pick a unit in 25", that unit is suffering D6 mortal wounds. ? irritating rule to me like they wrote it.


thanks a lot

 

[Aginor]

Yeah, it is weird. No clue why it was written that way. They mixed up fluff and rules there.

 

[ILKAIN]

one of many clarifying texts updates we require in our new tome...

 

[Killer Angel]

Yeah, as much as the text may be confusing, the core itself is pretty clear: abilities / effects that require LoS explicitly mention it. EotG MW "shoot" doesn't require LoS.

 

[Canas]

Meh, spells and abilities are one of the few where the phrasing is usually clear as it Always explicitly states if you need LoS or not. And since it usually corresponds to magic there's no reason to assume it actually works as a projectile. Magic can play by its own rules

What's a much weirder one is that nowhere is it mentioned that melee attacks require LoS (nor does being in combat). Which can lead to some fairly weird situations if you have someone who starts insisting on that...

 

[ILKAIN]

What's a much weirder one is that nowhere is it mentioned that melee attacks require LoS (nor does being in combat). Which can lead to some fairly weird situations if you have someone who starts insisting on that...

Just ask @IggyStarhost, he/she had a judge make him attack through a palisade endless spell because the other unit was within the 3" and the horns have that range on EOTG

 

[Canas]

Just ask @IggyStarhost, he/she had a judge make him attack through a palisade endless spell because the other unit was within the 3" and the horns have that range on EOTG

sigh… the literal point of that spell is being an impassable barrier, that's just a terrible decision.

But yeah, I emailed the F.A.Q. people about it, so hopefully they change it so that melee, and that control zone, need to be with LoS (or at least that you need to be able to have the range to go around the obstacle, a single pillar might not block the entire path)

 

[ILKAIN]

sigh… the literal point of that spell is being an impassable barrier, that's just a terrible decision.

But yeah, I emailed the F.A.Q. people about it, so hopefully they change it so that melee, and that control zone, need to be with LoS (or at least that you need to be able to have the range to go around the obstacle, a single pillar might not block the entire path)

It should have a rule for itself that basically states, this spell doesn't care if the spell/ability/attack/whatever requires LOS or not, when checking for targeting/measuring measure from the center of the active model to the center of the target mode/unit, if a 1mm wide line goes through the palisade the (insert whatever) cannot target that model/unit

 

[Canas]

It should have a rule for itself that basically states, this spell doesn't care if the spell/ability/attack/whatever requires LOS or not, when checking for targeting/measuring measure from the center of the active model to the center of the target mode/unit, if a 1mm wide line goes through the palisade the (insert whatever) cannot target that model/unit

To be honest I'd just say everything needs LoS unless explicitly stated otherwise, like in the case of skaven acolytes. That way you immeadiatly solve every possible discussion about this and you can Ensure as designers that the few exceptions are things that make, some semblance of, sense (e.g. I'm fine with the acolytes being able to just throw really really high so they can go over the barrier).

Plus, it'd help with differentiating spells and wizards. Giving powerfull wizards the ability to cast without LoS cuz they have mage-sight or some such would give those a definite boon and help distinguish them from regular wizards. Even if the spell itself is just another "do D3 damage".

 

[IggyStarhost]

Just ask @IggyStarhost, he/she had a judge make him attack through a palisade endless spell because the other unit was within the 3" and the horns have that range on EOTG

This skinks is a he

To be honest I'd just say everything needs LoS unless explicitly stated otherwise, like in the case of skaven acolytes. That way you immeadiatly solve every possible discussion about this and you can Ensure as designers that the few exceptions are things that make, some semblance of, sense (e.g. I'm fine with the acolytes being able to just throw really really high so they can go over the barrier).

Plus, it'd help with differentiating spells and wizards. Giving powerfull wizards the ability to cast without LoS cuz they have mage-sight or some such would give those a definite boon and help distinguish them from regular wizards. Even if the spell itself is just another "do D3 damage".

I agree with the logic, but not with the ruling. I always like to look at it from a fluff kind of way. I think you shouldnt be able to hit threw solid objects/terrain. Or can hit around a corner.
But requiring true line of sight would mean from its eyes. While I believe in some situations you can be in base contact with a bastiladon, but it couldnt see you. But in think it could still attack you with the tail

 

[Canas]

I agree with the logic, but not with the ruling. I always like to look at it from a fluff kind of way. I think you shouldnt be able to hit threw solid objects/terrain. Or can hit around a corner.
But requiring true line of sight would mean from its eyes. While I believe in some situations you can be in base contact with a bastiladon, but it couldnt see you. But in think it could still attack you with the tail

I did mean LoS as in draw a straight line between the two and see if they can see eachother. For it to be true line of sight from their eyes (or whatever it is they use to see.. ) we'd need to have stuff like rules for flanking as well which would go way to far. Plus what are you going to do with the fish-aelve thrall things that are blind then?

So just "can you draw an unobstructed line between the target and caster/attacker then great, you can affect the target with your ability/attack"

 

[IggyStarhost]

I did mean LoS as in draw a straight line between the two and see if they can see eachother. For it to be true line of sight from their eyes (or whatever it is they use to see.. ) we'd need to have stuff like rules for flanking as well which would go way to far. Plus what are you going to do with the fish-aelve thrall things that are blind then?

So just "can you draw an unobstructed line between the target and caster/attacker then great, you can affect the target with your ability/attack"

Agree. That and mostly common sense will clear most things up

 

[LizardWizard]

To be honest I'd just say everything needs LoS unless explicitly stated otherwise

This would make Sylvaneth Wyldwoods interesting. Nothing could really fight in ranks.