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8th Ed. Cheap Slann in a skink skirmish bus.

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Skink

Darkneo89

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Basically: is a viable choice to put a cheap slann (Focus of mystery and Reservoir of Eldrich energy and dragonbane gem) into an unit of skink skirmishes? The main idea is to save Lords point in a 2.4k list in order to use an oldblood (dawnstone, ironcurse, glittering scale).
My concern are: will the slann have enough power to capitalize the high magic loremaster? Will he be safe enough into skirmish? And eventually will it be a viable option to deploy him alone?
 
I believe some of the members have used this sucessfully...?
 
Sounds like a solid plan, most of high magic has a fair casting range right? As far as power dice I would just cast what you can in excess of 6D, then IF the fire-burning-ouchy-spell whose name escapes me. No worries if you blow up a few skirmishers in the process. If you dimensionally cascade, well then at least you have an OB :D. I like your idea though, I never really fathomed having both lords in a 2.4k match.
 
themuffinman873 said:
Sounds like a solid plan, most of high magic has a fair casting range right? As far as power dice I would just cast what you can in excess of 6D, then IF the fire-burning-ouchy-spell whose name escapes me. No worries if you blow up a few skirmishers in the process. If you dimensionally cascade, well then at least you have an OB :D. I like your idea though, I never really fathomed having both lords in a 2.4k match.
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Yes they do have a fair casting range, and I will use a skink priest as an arcane vassal! Hope the old blood will do a great job!
 
Skirmishers make for a fine and dandy slann bunker. However, while you will be protected from most BS shooting and will get an LoS, you are also in danger of panicking.

I've actually stopped using skirmishers as my slann bunker and started placing him in cohorts instead. It still protects against BS shooting, and you have more guys to lose. I've lost slanns and Tetto to panicking skirmishers that got shot to pieces with either a magic missile or with trueflight arrows.

Best part about putting a slann in a cohort: minimal loses from miscast explosions due to the slann sitting off to the side, rather than bunched up in the unit. Also, you don't care if the unit stays out of battle, because it only costs you 100 points or so.
 
LawGnome said:
Skirmishers make for a fine and dandy slann bunker. However, while you will be protected from most BS shooting and will get an LoS, you are also in danger of panicking.

I've actually stopped using skirmishers as my slann bunker and started placing him in cohorts instead. It still protects against BS shooting, and you have more guys to lose. I've lost slanns and Tetto to panicking skirmishers that got shot to pieces with either a magic missile or with trueflight arrows.

Best part about putting a slann in a cohort: minimal loses from miscast explosions due to the slann sitting off to the side, rather than bunched up in the unit. Also, you don't care if the unit stays out of battle, because it only costs you 100 points or so.
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Sounds really cool! It would probably more exposed to bs but he would probably be fine! What size of cohort unit do you suggest?
 
For 70 or so points, you can put him in a unit of skinks so he gets a look-out-sir!

Or for 65 points, you can make him ethereal and give him the dragonbane gem, at which point very little is actually able to kill him. Plus he neutralizes opposing monsters, steam tanks, and other things in combat. Plus you get the option to have him slaughter 900 point hordes of trolls in combat, although it costs a whopping 35 pts to add that.

I don't understand the prevailing lines of thought here :(
 
RipperDerek said:
For 70 or so points, you can put him in a unit of skinks so he gets a look-out-sir!

Or for 65 points, you can make him ethereal and give him the dragonbane gem, at which point very little is actually able to kill him. Plus he neutralizes opposing monsters, steam tanks, and other things in combat. Plus you get the option to have him slaughter 900 point hordes of trolls in combat, although it costs a whopping 35 pts to add that.

I don't understand the prevailing lines of thought here :(
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The main reason is that there is an unfortunate amount of magic attacks out there. Skaven, wood elves, hell cannons, skull crushers, DPs, daemons, whatever. Often times it is just easier to put him with a bunch of skinks rather than have your slann get taken out round one against a skaven cannon. If you are sure that you aren't going to be playing against magic shooting, then by all means take him as ethereal. However, if you aren't sure what you are going to be up against, I think the skinks are a better choice.


I've been running him in a cohort of 20. It's 100 points, but it gives you some extra shooting, and its a hell of a lot cheaper than a TG bunker.
 
Skinks won't help against almost everything in that list: skull crushers, DPs, daemons, elf shooting, whatever. The hellcannon you mention, like almost all of the magical cannons / etc. in the game, is flaming (2+ ward from gem). Plus he already has a 4+ ward and 5 wounds against everything else.

The problem is that people have poor pattern recognition.

- I put my Slann in my temple guard. He miscast and blew up the unit!
- I put my Slann in my temple guard. The unit costs 750 points. My opponent's 750 point unit obliterated us in combat!
- I put my Slann in my temple guard. The Slann got challenged and died!
- I put my Slann in my temple guard. I kept them out of combat to protect the Slann, but then my TG contributed nothing to the game!
- I put my Slann in my unit of skinks. The unit panicked and I lost my Slann!
- I put my Slann in my unit of skinks. He miscast and almost all of them died, and then he didn't get a look-out-sir anymore!
- I put my Slann in my unit of skinks. The skinks were killed by (arrows / spells / chaff) and then my Slann was all alone!
- I put my Slann in my unit of skinks. It didn't help at all against that thing with magical attacks that charged the unit!

Vs., I made my Slann ethereal and alone. He survived the entire game, killed 900 points worth of models in combat and got off several pivotal spells. His miscasts weren't a big deal because he didn't hurt anything else, and with 5 wounds and a 4+ ward it's hard for him to hurt himself too bad.

Nah...better go back to the other ideas.
 
The real issue is the magical shooting. I face a lot of skaven and wood elves. There is very little reason to try ethereal, since that guarantees that you will lose your slann early.

I was giving examples of things you might face if you were to play in a tournament style event. Sure, your ethereal slann is a great idea against things like high elves and ogres, but if you see a skaven player, you are just donating your general to him. Since you cannot join a unit ever, those games are going to be more painful.

If you run your slann with a cohort bunker, you can run him solo if you aren't facing much shooting, you can run him in the cohort if you are facing a lot of shooting, and you can choose to place him with saurus or temple guard if you feel it is a wiser choice, depending on the matchup.

I would rather run a 100 point bunker as a "just in case" than run ethereal and get totally screwed if I face magic shooting.


The reason I mentioned the other things, such as the DP and the skullcrushers, is that they have the unfortunate tendency of getting into the face of your solo slann. However, a cohort isn't going to do much to stop a DP, and I realize that. If you have a non-ethereal slann, though, you can react to that scenario by placing the slann with your saurus or a unit of TG (if you have one).

I feel that running a non-ethereal slann is safer because it gives you options.
 
Now, I don't want to be the judge of the discussion (since I started to play 6 months ago, so there are sooo many things I have to try in order to give my "professional" opinion), but I'll try the non ethereal slann for a simple reason: I can deploy it wherever I want him;
That means (correct me if I'm wrong) :
-I can deploy him solo. He has his dragonbane gem and I would do that only if there are not obvious counter to this strategy (like daemon prince). The cohort is obviously not wasted since it can add some combat resolution with flank charge and it shoot a lot.
-I can deploy him in the cohort / skirmish, and let this unit stay protected behind my main saurus block.
-I can deploy him in the second rank of the Saurus block (since I have 2 saurus characters on cold one which can join the block too, and the unit of cold one riders are pretty a stand alone unit since they are 7 with full cmd). And that is the tactic I should choose if there is a daemon prince ready to oneshot my poor slann.
Am I doing this right?
 
Not really seeing the problem with the ethereal slann.

Sure, magic shooting is a problem - 4+ ward helps a lot though, and with trancendant healing and high lore, you can heal yourself forever, making it completely impossible to kill him, aside from outright 1-shotting him, which is incredibly unlikely. Not only do they have to hit, which heavens magic and chameleons can help shut down, they also have to break through a 4+ ward save, and THEN deal a minimum of 5 wounds. Hitting aside (because that can vary a whole lot), you are looking at a 14% chance against non-flaming attacks, or about 4% against flaming attacks. Again, this is AFTER hitting, so the actual chance to kill him is much, MUCH lower.

Considering how dangerous magic already is, I don't see how this is problem - and better yet, this means that cannon isn't going for your big and dangerous dinosaurs, and if you have tetto as well, you aren't exactly losing all of your magic potential if the slann dies.
 
I don't really see problems with ethereal slann in general, I see problem to fit him in my list. I have 231 point of Saurus oldblood in a 2400 points list. Meaning I can spend 369 points on a slann. Ethereal slann costs 360 points (without any other update). I'm playing euro format so I can't use Tetto... This is the complete list so you all can have a better idea.




+ Lords + (591pts)

* Saurus Oldblood (231pts)
(Cold-Blooded, Predatory Fighter, Scaly Skin (*))
Great Weapon
* Cold One
Cold One (Fear, Stupidity, Swiftstride, Thick-skinned)
* Magic Items
BRB - Dawnstone, BRB - Glittering Scales, BRB - Ironcurse Icon


* Slann Mage-Priest (360pts)
(Cold-Blooded, Mage-Priest Palanquin, Shield of the Old Ones, Telepathic Confabulation)
Lore of High Magic, Wizard Level 4
* Disciplines of the Old Ones
Focus of Mystery (*), Reservoir of Eldritch Energy (*)
* Magic Items
BRB - Dragonbane Gem


+ Heroes + (269pts)

* Saurus Scar-Veteran
(Cold-Blooded, Predatory Fighter, Scaly Skin (*))
Battle Standard Bearer, Great Weapon
* Cold One
Cold One (Fear, Stupidity, Swiftstride, Thick-skinned)
* Magic Items
BRB - Armour of Destiny


* Skink Priest
(Aquatic, Arcane Vassal, Cold-Blooded, Scaly Skin (*))
Lore of Beasts, Wizard Level 1
* Magic Items
BRB - Dispel Scroll


+ Core + (615pts)

* Saurus Warriors (305pts)
Champion, Musician, Standard Bearer
* 25x Saurus Warrior
(Cold-Blooded, Predatory Fighter, Scaly Skin (*))
25x Spears


* Skink Cohort (100pts)
20x Skink (Aquatic, Cold-Blooded, Scaly Skin (*), Spawn-kin)


* Skink Skirmishers (70pts)
* 10x Skink Skirmisher
(Aquatic, Cold-Blooded, Scaly Skin (*), Skirmishers (FAQ'ed))
10x Lustrian Javelins with Shield


* Skink Skirmishers (70pts)
* 10x Skink Skirmisher
(Aquatic, Cold-Blooded, Scaly Skin (*), Skirmishers (FAQ'ed))
10x Lustrian Javelins with Shield


* Skink Skirmishers (70pts)
* 10x Skink Skirmisher
(Aquatic, Cold-Blooded, Scaly Skin (*), Skirmishers (FAQ'ed))
10x Lustrian Javelins with Shield


+ Special + (508pts)

* Cold One Riders
Champion, Cold One (Fear, Stupidity, Swiftstride, Thick-skinned), Musician, Standard Bearer
* 7x Cold One Rider
(Cold-Blooded, Predatory Fighter, Scaly Skin (*))
7x Spears


* Ripperdactyl Riders
Ripperdactyl (Armour Piercing, Fast Cavalry, Fear, Fly, Frenzy, Killing Blow, Stomp, Swiftstride), 3x Ripperdactyl Rider (Cold-Blooded, Scaly Skin (*), Toad Rage)


* Ripperdactyl Riders
Ripperdactyl (Armour Piercing, Fast Cavalry, Fear, Fly, Frenzy, Killing Blow, Stomp, Swiftstride), 3x Ripperdactyl Rider (Cold-Blooded, Scaly Skin (*), Toad Rage)


+ Rare + (414pts)

* Ancient Stegadon
5x Crew, Two Giant Blowpipes
* Ancient Stegadon
(Cold-Blooded, Howdah Crew, Immune to Psychology, Impact Hits (D6+1) (FAQ'ed), Large Target, Scaly Skin (*), Stubborn, Terror, Thunderstomp)
Sharpened Horns (*)


* Salamander Hunting Pack
* Salamander Hunting Pack
(Aquatic, Cold-Blooded, Hunting Pack, Skirmishers (FAQ'ed))
Extra Handler, 3x Handlers, Salamander (Fear, Scaly Skin (*), Spout Flames, Stomp, Swiftstride)
* Salamander Hunting Pack
(Aquatic, Cold-Blooded, Hunting Pack, Skirmishers (FAQ'ed))
3x Handlers, Salamander (Fear, Scaly Skin (*), Spout Flames, Stomp, Swiftstride)



Created with BattleScribe (http://www.battlescribe.net)
 
Just to remind that the whole topic was about the efficiency of a low point slann with focus of mystery, and how to cheaply save him from being slaughtered... Unfortunately ethereal is not even an option. I will surely try that way in some future list.
 
The nice thing about Skirmisher bunkered wizards, is that if you run the miscast that only hurts units in base to base contact, NOTHING HAPPENS! I did that twice in a game once. My opponent was amused and upset at the same time. It wasn't a Slann but the concept applies.
 
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