8th Ed. Advice Needed with 2500 Monster Mash

[archangel]

Hi,
I am building\collecting a dinosaur based Lustrian army and would appreciate any advice on my most recent draft:

Old-Blood, Fencers Blades, Steg Helmet, light armour, OTS, Carnosaur, loping stride

Scar-Vet, Sword Strife, Ench Shield, Ironcurse item, light armour, Carnosaur, loping stride
L2 Skink Priest, Beasts, Dispell Scroll
L2 Skink Priest, Beasts, Cube

30 Saurus Warriors, full command
10 Skink Skirmishers, Javelin + shield x 4

Bastiladon + solar engine
3 Ripperdactyls

Ancient Steg + Engine of the Gods
Troglodon + Div Rod

I'm unsure about the build of the two Carnosaur riders. Is there a more optimum way to equip them?

Would I be better off with 9 Chameleon Skinks rather than the Rippers?

I understand the limitations of the Trog, but he's in.

Any comments will be appreciated, although I know that gun-line armies are going to make me suffer!

Cheers.

 

[Noveltyboy]

My monster list at 2k had carno lord. Bsb on Ancient. 2x aancientsand 30 saurus 2x 10 skirmishers. Played high elves lost 10 skinks and my bsb but not his mount. Lord had egg armour or destiny and sword of striking. I always give carno both upgrades help so much against all armiee.

 

[archangel]

Is a BSB really necessary? I rarely bother with my Woodies and although Lustrian leadership is lower, surely our cold blooded rule means we are quite likely to stay put?

In the previous version of my army list (not published) I had a Skink BSB, but to afford this both my Priests were level 1 and I felt that the extra levels were worth more than the BSB; was I wrong?

 

[Noveltyboy]

I dont see why you wouldnt want a bsb. I forgot I had a lvl 2 skink priest with heavens and a dispel in that list. Cold blooded is good but rank bonus on enemy units is not your friend plus the day you lose to a bad ld test you will regret not having one. 18" bubble on ld 8 with reroll if hes near your lord is great especially with skinks around.

 

[Komi-Quazi]

Your first problem is you don't have the required 25 percent Core troops
you need just under 200 points more for a 2500 point army. 2nd the engine of the Gods in the new rules is a waste of points half as effective as it used to be. you'd be better off taking the blow pipes if you wanted a anceint steg - If it's for the magic a seperate Skink shammy would be better. you could give him cloak of feathers and bounce back and forth behind saurus and monsters w/ lore of beasts spaming the signature spell str 5 t 5 saurus unit scary. Xtra points maybe put toward getting core up to 625 points(min 25 %). If your going monster theme stay with ripperdactlys they can take care of any warmachines just as good as chameleon skinks.

With new rules we playin 3000 points and it's still hard to fit in everything I want to use. But the Oldblood is a good set up I did somthin close. I gave him sword of striking +1 to hit hitting useally on 2's 3's at most. And cheaper then fencing blades( which I was going to give him ) so I could get the 4+ ward pendant . To make him more survivable ( I'm paranoid though)

the WS 10 makes him pretty surivable as well in HTH so it's a matter of preferance.

I use a BSB (on slann when I use one) but in my monster army I give to a Scar vet w/ skavenpelt - making unit frenzied - on a cold one in a unit of cold one riders. giving him 5 A reg saurus 3 A the cold ones now have 2 A and unit champ 4A thats alot of str 4 & 5 Attacks. I'll let you know how it works
28 attacks mmmm like Chaos Knights. Scary

-

 

[archangel]

Thanks for your comments K-Q.

My core is around 640, so over the 625 minimum. I tried to avoid posting the points as I know the mods don't like that sort of thing.

The Engine of the Gods was for the Arcane Config and the Burning Alignment spell, with only having Skinky Priests, I need all the help I can get in the magic phase. That's also why I chose the Solar Engine and the Divining Rod.

I like the idea of the bouncing, flying skink, but also tend to think that most of my spells are going to be dispelled anyway and that they are really there to close down the opposition's magic phase for a couple of turns, by then my dinos should be in combat.

I'm tending towards the Rippers as well, they do fit the monster theme better than the chameleon skinks. Is it OK to run a unit of 3, or should I be looking at increasing the unit size?

I take your point about the sword of striking, but I was looking to increase the number of attacks to make the most of predatory fighter and the Trog's bellow. The ws 10 will also help keep him alive. An invulnerable save is very attractive and I would always go this way with my elves, however I am trying to be more aggressive in approach with the Lizardmen, let's see if it works!

My Carnosaurs are already frenzied, so I don't like paying for something twice. I am though, considering a naked skink BSB to hang back behind the skink cloud and next to the saurus block.

Has anyone used the Skrox unit? I could replace my saurus with a 4krox\skink unit that would be much better at keeping up with the rest of my units. Currently the saurus and Bastiladon will very much end up being a second wave attack, but perhaps that's not a bad thing?

Keep the comments coming folks.

 

[Noveltyboy]

Firstly carnos only frenzy after they inflict a wound. Also your core is fine and flexible I often run simular to great effect. Being WS 10 isnt the best thing unless your taking glittering scales as most elite armies and characters or even just woc armies will still hit you in 4s. Combine the 2 items though and your laughing. That being said all your doing is making the choice to hit the carno an easier one. He is WS3 and can dish out more damage with thunderstomps and has a worse save so most sensible people kill him first. So your lord hitting on 2s and having thr egg helps keep the carno alive if you roll well.

 

[serekth]

My Carnosaurs are already frenzied, so I don't like paying for something twice. I am though, considering a naked skink BSB to hang back behind the skink cloud and next to the saurus block.

Just make your Scar Vet the BSB. The benefit is having an 18" BSB range.

 

[Sebbs]

My friend is about to do a monster mash and he said the most sensible thing. He'll be using something like 3x5 Chameleon Skinks to really be able to deal with the warmachines. But since you are using rippers maybe take 2x5? Some people just can't get enough warmachines it seems, they can really mess with your day

.

 

[archangel]

I agree that the two carnosaurs are very vulnerable to early attacks. After having read several threads on dual carnosaurs, a lot of posters seem to go with the crown of command\armour of destiny on their O\B, with the charmed shield and tali of preservation on their S\V. I was playing with this approach, but didn't find it aggressive enough, I thought I could put the Steg Helm on the S\V to provide a little more punch.

Since reading the more recent posts on this topic, I am persuaded that it is more important for the O\B to get his attacks in early to help protect the carnosaur. I'm now looking at giving him the Steg Helm, with the sword of swift slaying and the OTS, while my S\V could have the gold sigil sword and the egg. I am hoping to run these two together, so they both attack the same unit at the same time (hopefully in the flank!!). What do you all think?

I'm also looking at two units of Skrox (2 Krox + 16 pois. Skinks each) to replace the 30 saurus block + one of my skirmishing skink units. Has anyone compared these options? The krox would be so much better at keeping up with the rest of the force. Also, would one unit with 4 krox be better than the two, or vice versa? The bigger unit would pack more punch, but lack manouverability and be more susceptible to magic and missiles.

All comments appreciated.

 

[hdctambien]

I'm also looking at two units of Skrox (2 Krox + 16 pois. Skinks each) to replace the 30 saurus block + one of my skirmishing skink units. Has anyone compared these options? The krox would be so much better at keeping up with the rest of the force. Also, would one unit with 4 krox be better than the two, or vice versa?

I think you would be best served by having a single large unit of Skrox. 16 skinks can be killed/broken pretty quickly, 32 skinks will take twice as long, which should be enough of a Tarpit for you to get your Carnosaurs and Steg into position for a flank charge (or give them time to finish off their first combats and line up for an overun/future charge)

Either way, the skinks aren't really there for their killy-powers, only for their numbers (like skaven slaves) so I wouldn't put any points into giving them poison (I would give them a Standard though, and even a Champion to waste a character's time with a challenge). I'd spend that on 10-12 more skinks (in the cohort or don't ditch the 10 skirmisher unit).

Alternatively, you might try 2 units of 1 Krox+32 non-poison skinks (Quick math tells me that runs the same cost as 2 krox + 16 poison skinks) And run them as tarpits for your big monsters.

I'm tending towards the Rippers as well, they do fit the monster theme better than the chameleon skinks. Is it OK to run a unit of 3, or should I be looking at increasing the unit size?

I haven't had a lot of luck with 3 Rippers. 2 of them tend to die from shooting before they ever get a chance to do their job. I think 5-6 is a good unit size, or possibly 2 units of 6 for a little more flexibility.

 

[archangel]

I'm tending to agree that the speedier Skrox are looking as though they will be a better compliment to the rest of my army, kkeping up with the faster dinos. One large unit will also look more threatening and suit my tactic of target saturation. A big scary skrox block, 2 carnies, a steg, a bastie and a Trog should look quite impressive and offer a selection of targets.

Your comment about the rippers chimes with my own anxieties about this unit. I have had quite good success with lone hero eagle riders in my woodies and was hoping these could fulfil a similar role. Any suggestions for an anti artillery dino squad? I suspect that terradons are even more fragile. I could replace the rippers with a couple of razordons or 3 krox. I doubt either though would be able to get to any warmachine in time. I suppose 9 chameleon skinks are a possible option, it's just that they are not very dinosaury!!

 

[hdctambien]

Any suggestions for an anti artillery dino squad? I suspect that terradons are even more fragile

For a while I was running a Skink Chief on a Terradon with the Stegadon Helm and Luckstone. 2+ save (reroll once)
, extra Toughness, Impact Hits, Dropping rocks, poison javalin.. he's a toughter-than-expected nut to crack and not too expensive to have flying around where he's likely to get killed.

Replacing the Stegadon Helm with the Fencers Blades and Dragonhelm might be really good at taking out some warmachines. Also, putting him on a Ripper rather than a Terradon could add some extra punch (but lose a little control)

I bet both a Stegadon Helm Chief on a Terradon and a Fencer Blades Chief on a Ripper would be frightening for warmachine crew everywhere AND make for a wacky duo on a Saturday morning cartoon!

 

[archangel]

Those two sound like Dastardly and Muttley in "Catch the Pigeon!" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sj6-LG5VpGk

A great idea, but unfortunately I am already maxed out on my Hero selection. I could drop the Priests, but then I would be trading vulnerability in the shooting phase, for a weakness in the magic phase. There are just too many options!!!!

 

[lbisson]

Have you read ZaGreekie's Dual Carno Tactica? If not, you should. i run a dual Carno list and ran the OldBlood with a great weapon. That way the Carno strikes before the OB. Get into combat and challenge, you want the higher number of attacks for the Carno to go first in the challenge since overkill counts towards combat res.

I guess it depends what your target is for the OldBlood.

Cheers

 

[archangel]

ZaGreegie's tactica is excellent. I just feel that the carno is going to be dead, unless I can get the O\B to eliminate the opposition first. Remember I am going to aim to run the two carnos together, so although there might be a hold up with one, the second is hopefully chewing into the unit at the same time. Even then I would still be wary of sending the two tough guys in against a horde, they will need support to tackle this, even with flank attacks.

 

[Komi-Quazi]

Thanks for your comments K-Q.

My core is around 640, so over the 625 minimum. I tried to avoid posting the points as I know the mods don't like that sort of thing.

My Carnosaurs are already frenzied, so I don't like paying for something twice. I am though, considering a naked skink BSB to hang back behind the skink cloud and next to the saurus block.

Has anyone used the Skrox unit? I could replace my saurus with a 4krox\skink unit that would be much better at keeping up with the rest of my units. Currently the saurus and Bastiladon will very much end up being a second wave attack, but perhaps that's not a bad thing?

Keep the comments coming folks.

Sorry I didn't see the X4 next to the skink skirmishers.

I wasn't suggesting putting a BSB with a carnasur, just was giving a reason to use a BSB.

And I havn't used a skrox unit , but everybody I talk to said now that you can pick out the Kroxigors in HTH you might as well get unit of those then using them together. But again I havn't used them in 8th edition yet I'll let you know when I do.

 

[archangel]

Thanks for all the comments. I've started a new thread with my latest list. Go on, have a peek, you know you want to...