8th Ed. 2400 point ETC tournament list. Help requested.

[Auglavie]

Hello fellow generals.
I am not new to the game, but I am new to Lizardmen. I just love the idea of running an army of Aztec lizards.

Here is my first attempt at a competitive list, I appreciate any and all advice.

2500Pts
Lords:
Slann, bsb, harmonic convergence, focus of mastery, becalming cogitation, channelling staff, Ironcurse Icon, obsidian amulet, standard of discipline.

Heroes:
Skink Priest (beasts), dispel scroll, dragonbane gem.

Skink Priest (heavens), cube of darkness.

Scar-vet, Great Weapon, cold one, Armour of Destiny.

Scar-vet, Great Weapon, cold one, gambler's armour, Dawnstone, potion of foolhardiness.

Scar-vet, Great weapon, cold one, stegadon helm, seed of rebirth, light armour.

Core:
4 x Skink skirmishers x 10, javelin and Shield.

Saurus Warriors x 30, spears, musician, standard.

Special:
Bastiladon (lazerbeam)

Temple guard x 20, musician, standard.

Rare:
Ancient Stegadon, engine of the gods.

The slaan goes with the TG. The cowboys will be on their own, to hunt characters and warmachines, and to take out chaff. The skinks will form a cloud and cover my army, while anoying my enemy. The two monsters will support the army, and charge in if need be.

What do you all think, is it any good? Is there anything I should change?
Thanks in advance for any input!

 

[Gary_M]

I have a question on the numbers of potential spells you have. Apart from Loremaster on High Magic (all 8? spells) you've got at least another 2 spells due to the priests (I'm assuming they're both level 1). So thats 10 potential spells. You've then got the lazerbeam and the engine of the gods spells. You've got a lot of choice, but will you have enough dice?
Personally, I'd drop the basti, and remove the EotG and use the Blowpipes. With High Magic the spell which allows you to increase BS (Hand of Glory?) will boost the BS enough so that even if moving, multiple shot and long range, poison will still count.
I would add either Terradons or chamo skinks for warmachine hunting (my preference is terradons, but not really practised with chamo skinks yet).
I don't have my army book/rule book with me so can't really comment on the various load outs for scar vets etc
Hope this helps.

 

[Akholrak]

I think it looks fairly solid. As Gary_M has put, you have got a lot of spells, and likely not enough dice to go around. Therefore, I would also recommend dropping the Bastilidon as well as one of the Cowboys and increase the size of the Temple Guard unit (I consider 24 to be a minimum). You could also include a Salamander to lay on the hurt on infantry blocks. I'd also find points to add Champions to the Saurus and Temple Guard.

 

[Auglavie]

Thank you for the input. I was actually thinking of dropping the bastilodon and the ancient steg, and the cube of darkness skink priest. There were too many spells. I am thinking of taking two regular stegs, one with bow because that is the model I own, and one with blowpipes. I was also thinking of going up in Temple guard numbers. Why is 24 ideal? Also, I come from empire and goblins, so I am not used to buying unit champs. Are they worth it for lizards? Thanks again for the input.

 

[Auglavie]

Also, I was contemplating dropping one of the scarvets and picking up either razordons or terradons and or a salamander pack. Which of the flyers is better overall?

 

[Akholrak]

I would keep the CoD Skink Priest, just for another channelling attempt, Arcane Vassal and another Scroll.

I wouldn't say 24 is "ideal", more the "minimum you should take". Whilst I too have only been a Lizardmen player for a short time, I found that opponents put a lot of firepower into my Temple Guard which was bunkering my Slaan. Therefore, you need as many bodies as you can to sustain the losses that you are likely to take at range or even in combat.

Out of our Flyers, I'd say Terradons. This might be personal preference, but I think they make for better chaff than Ripperdactyls, simply by being able to flee and to run interference. They also make for a great Fast Cav/Skirmisher killers with their drop rocks. Finally, you don't have to worry about Frenzy.

I'd pick a Salamander. You already have a lot of BS shooting, more say if you take an Ancient Stegadon with Blowpipes. A Salamander is able to put the hurt on infantry, something that our shooting is not as capable of doing. I do love Razordons, but in this case, the Salamander is the better choice.

 

[Agrem]

This is just my preference but I feel that the banner of discipline is a bit wasted on Slann. LD10 vs LD9 coldblooded with rerolls has essentially the same rate of success (99,9% vs 99,7% I believe it was). Granted it will help out when taking break tests, but you don't want to be taking those anyway.

Also I feel that the absolute best upgrade for the stegadon is the sharpened horns. Maybe consider changing the EotG for those as others have pointed out you are running thin on dice. Quite a solid list otherwise.

BR
Agrem

 

[NIGHTBRINGER]

This is just my preference but I feel that the banner of discipline is a bit wasted on Slann. LD10 vs LD9 coldblooded with rerolls has essentially the same rate of success (99,9% vs 99,7% I believe it was).

I disagree; I love the banner of discipline. It is such a cheap item and worth every penny. It really comes into use for other units that are taking modified (due to combat resolution) break tests. The difference between leadership 6 vs 7 for example is quite significant and you only have to make a single break test for the banner to make up its points cost many times over. I like the added reliability, but then again, I'm a defensive player by nature.

 

[Agrem]

Yes I agree that against those break tests it does come in handy. But with everything else it's really not that much use. Although it is cheap and can be easily just bought for the extra insurance. I do however usually prefer the +1M banner for the same pricetag.

BR
Agrem

 

[Auglavie]

So I have taken all the comments into consideration, and I have created a completely new list. Apparently the tournament is actually 2400 points in the ETC format, so I had to accomodate for that.

Lords:
Slann, BSB, Banner of discipline, becalming cogitation, mystery, harmonic convergence, channelling staff, Ironcurse Icon, obsidian amulet.
- I believe this is 2 ETC points

Heroes:
Scar-Vet, Cold One, GW, Gambler's Armour, Dawnstone, Potion of Foolhardiness.

Scar-Vet, Cold One, GW, Armour of Destiny.
- Another Point here.

Skink Priest, Dispel Scroll, Seed of Rebirth.

Core:
2 x 10 Skink Skirmishers, Javelins and Shields.
1 x 11 Skink Skirmishers, Javelins and Shields.
3 x 16 Skink Cohorts, Poisoned Attacks, Musician, Banner.

Special:
Stegadon, Sharpened Horns, Bow.

26 x Temple Guard, Full Command.

Rare:
Ancient Stegadon, Sharpened Horns, Blowpipes.

This is exactly 2400 points, and uses three of five ETC points.

I dropped the saurus warriors because they seemed far less impressive than a cloud of Skinks. I am sad though, because I love the models. Oh well. The cowboys will start out in the temple guard unit, or will deploy on the flanks to take out warmachines or chaff. The steggs will support each other, and Will be supported by the slann.

So, what does everyone think?

 

[Agrem]

Looks quite standard ETC list to me par the stegadons that are usually just replaced with more skinks
Your second cowboy is actually two points so you tally out total of 4/5.

I like the list as you should have plenty of target saturation between the stegadons and cowboys if you run up against warmachines. I don't really know if the poisoned attacks are really worth the points on cohorts and perhaps they could be replaced by one additional unit.

BR
Agrem

 

[Auglavie]

The only reason for the poison attacks is because I don't have any more models to make another whole unit of skinks. Thank you for the input though.

 

[Irish_Lizard]

Not sure on the stegs but I'd be very interested in how they perform. you can tighten up your character kit a bit. Drop seed of rebirth as it will do nothing. The dawnstone vet should be either dragonhelm, dawnstone, other tricksters or sword of might, charmed shield, dawnstone. Both setups work better than gamblers armour. If you can scrounge up some unit fillers or 11 more skinks, the standard core setup for most etc lists is 3x 10 skirmishers and 3x 20 cohort with full command. Highly recommend fitting razor banner on the TG, without it they will struggle against empire, woc and 1+ characters. I'd consider swapping discipline for MR3 as the LD increase is minuscule and you'd be surprised how fast TG die(admittedly mostly to miscasts where MR doesnt help).

What armies do you think you can beat and what do you think will table you?

 

[Mr Phat]

you are not counting points Correct

The current restrict is

Lizardmen

● Slann MagePriest, Lord Kroak, Lord Mazdamundi 1 choice each

● Discipline of Harmonic Convergence 1 choice

● Character mounted on Cold One above 1 - 2 choices each

● Flying unit and/or character above 3 - 1 choice each

● Unit of Core Skink Skirmishers above 3 - 1 choice each

● Unit of Skink Cohort above 3 1 choice each

● Tetto’Eko 3 choices


Slann - 1
Harmonic Convergance - 1
Second Mounted scar vet - 2

So you are in fact using 4 out of 5

If I where you I would use the last point to make one of your cohorts into skirmisher.
Would remove the problem with too few models too

 

[Auglavie]

Not sure on the stegs but I'd be very interested in how they perform. you can tighten up your character kit a bit. Drop seed of rebirth as it will do nothing. The dawnstone vet should be either dragonhelm, dawnstone, other tricksters or sword of might, charmed shield, dawnstone. Both setups work better than gamblers armour. If you can scrounge up some unit fillers or 11 more skinks, the standard core setup for most etc lists is 3x 10 skirmishers and 3x 20 cohort with full command. Highly recommend fitting razor banner on the TG, without it they will struggle against empire, woc and 1+ characters. I'd consider swapping discipline for MR3 as the LD increase is minuscule and you'd be surprised how fast TG die(admittedly mostly to miscasts where MR doesnt help).

What armies do you think you can beat and what do you think will table you?

I believe I will be able to beat the dwarf players in the tournament (there are two), and I feel that I could defeat the empire player because he spams infantry and balthazar gelt. The two dark elf players will give me some trouble, as may the high elf player (she usually runs white lion deathstar with banner of the world dragon and either an anointed, or some other unit wide ward save) the others should be pretty even. There are a lot of chaos and warriors of chaos players in my meta as well.

I believe that leadership 10 Will be quite useful for when I try sniping with spirit leech, also having leadership 10 for skink rallies will be exceptionally useful I feel.

I may indeed drop the two steggadons for the tournament, as there are going to be lots of cannons. I may pick up some cold one riders and the razor standard for the temple guard.

When you say units of 20 skink cohorts, how should I run them? Should I run them 10 by 2, or 5 by 4, or 7 by 3, or is there some more optimal set-up?

Thank you all for the wonderful tactics and input!

 

[Agrem]

I believe that leadership 10 Will be quite useful for when I try sniping with spirit leech, also having leadership 10 for skink rallies will be exceptionally useful I feel.

When you say units of 20 skink cohorts, how should I run them? Should I run them 10 by 2, or 5 by 4, or 7 by 3, or is there some more optimal set-up?

The leadership banner does not work with spirit leech I'm afraid. It's really messed up writing in the GW FAQ but ETC FAQ states that they do not stack.

The latter then depends mostly on your playstyle. I do like to run them in two ranks to max out the shots but they become quite wide and technically a bit slower that way.

BR
Agrem