AoS How is everyone doing?

[Jason839]

Just though the seraphon section was pretty quiet last few months. How has everyone been?

 

[Just A Skink]

Yes, it has been quiet... too quiet. Sadly, no Seraphon discussions much these days.

 

[Jason839]

Yes, it has been quiet... too quiet. Sadly, no Seraphon discussions much these days.

Its a shame. we are in a pretty strong spot. with the new updates they are doing this month, we have the chance to get some cool new toys.

 

[- Q -]

Sadly AoS discussion has seemed to have completely dried up. Maybe we just need a new book release to spice things up around here.

 

[Imrahil]

Sadly AoS discussion has seemed to have completely dried up. Maybe we just need a new book release to spice things up around here.

My misgiving with it is the constant release of books and editions... I feel no need to get into the rules, list building and playstyles if in a couple of years everything changes and I had just 3 or 4 games in.

I do like new models though, getting new models is always nice

Grrr, !mrahil

 

[Jason839]

My misgiving with it is the constant release of books and editions... I feel no need to get into the rules, list building and playstyles if in a couple of years everything changes and I had just 3 or 4 games in.

I do like new models though, getting new models is always nice

Grrr, !mrahil

yes if you dont get to play much i could see the annoyance. if you play every week and regularly play in tournaments, it feels like things do not change fast enough lol

 

[- Q -]

My misgiving with it is the constant release of books and editions... I feel no need to get into the rules, list building and playstyles if in a couple of years everything changes and I had just 3 or 4 games in.

I do like new models though, getting new models is always nice

Grrr, !mrahil

I've never played Age of Sigmar myself, but I think the forum is better if more games are being enjoyed and discussed. Currently it doesn't seem like any game is being talked about on the forum.

 

[Jason839]

I've never played Age of Sigmar myself, but I think the forum is better if more games are being enjoyed and discussed. Currently it doesn't seem like any game is being talked about on the forum.

for sure. any kind of engagement like battle reports will encourage others to join in. there is even a cool battle report app called tabletop battles that helps do that

 

[Kilvakar]

Very late reply, but I also miss the regular discussions here, even if it was just people grumping about how weak Seraphon/Lizardmen were and trying to figure out how to win battles, lol!

I've just been very lethargic about getting into 4e since it looks like we won't be getting a battletome until the end of the edition again. And while the core 4e rules look decent the army rules are pretty boring and scream "we wanted to remove as much math as possible so the the TikTok kids could get into it!" Not that I want to be doing tons of math ever round, but I do wish there was a bit more to the game than "shove your models into the circle and keep them there longer than your opponent's models."

I could be massively misrepresenting the game though since I haven't really bothered reading the rulebooks that have come out so far. I know that the current GHB rules made the Carnosaur decent at fighting but that's only for one season and will probably go away in six months. Kroak getting nerfed to regular Slann levels of casting is annoying, GW really seems to be underplaying him in the setting despite him being literally the oldest being in the setting other than the Chaos gods and still wants to push the new Elf gods as the main characters of AoS.

But TLDR, basically for me I feel hesitant to try to learn a new edition every three years since I don't get to actually play but maybe once every couple months. And I'm already getting frustrated knowing that we'll probably get our 4e book at the end of the current edition and thus get basically no time with full army rules. It just kind of has me down on AoS overall

 

[Just A Skink]

Very late reply, but I also miss the regular discussions here, even if it was just people grumping about how weak Seraphon/Lizardmen were and trying to figure out how to win battles, lol!

I've just been very lethargic about getting into 4e since it looks like we won't be getting a battletome until the end of the edition again. And while the core 4e rules look decent the army rules are pretty boring and scream "we wanted to remove as much math as possible so the the TikTok kids could get into it!" Not that I want to be doing tons of math ever round, but I do wish there was a bit more to the game than "shove your models into the circle and keep them there longer than your opponent's models."

I could be massively misrepresenting the game though since I haven't really bothered reading the rulebooks that have come out so far. I know that the current GHB rules made the Carnosaur decent at fighting but that's only for one season and will probably go away in six months. Kroak getting nerfed to regular Slann levels of casting is annoying, GW really seems to be underplaying him in the setting despite him being literally the oldest being in the setting other than the Chaos gods and still wants to push the new Elf gods as the main characters of AoS.

But TLDR, basically for me I feel hesitant to try to learn a new edition every three years since I don't get to actually play but maybe once every couple months. And I'm already getting frustrated knowing that we'll probably get our 4e book at the end of the current edition and thus get basically no time with full army rules. It just kind of has me down on AoS overall

I'm sorry to read that you're so down on 4e AoS. I think 4e is a good version of the game, but parts of it are probably a bit too oversimplified. And I'm not totally sold on the newest GHB rules, yet. AoS, in general, has been moving towards focusing on objectives and tactics for a while. But there are still battle tactics that require you to destroy a model/unit to achieve it, so combat is important.

GW seems to have made many of their games more abstract to make it better for tournament play, I assume. So, I'm sure that sours players who are more story-driven or flavor-driven.

Kroak is a pretty good wizard in this game, but I agree that he's not as overwhelming as I think he is in stories.

 

[Kilvakar]

I'm sorry to read that you're so down on 4e AoS. I think 4e is a good version of the game, but parts of it are probably a bit too oversimplified. And I'm not totally sold on the newest GHB rules, yet. AoS, in general, has been moving towards focusing on objectives and tactics for a while. But there are still battle tactics that require you to destroy a model/unit to achieve it, so combat is important.

GW seems to have made many of their games more abstract to make it better for tournament play, I assume. So, I'm sure that sours players who are more story-driven or flavor-driven.

Kroak is a pretty good wizard in this game, but I agree that he's not as overwhelming as I think he is in stories.

Honestly I feel like it's less a dislike for 4e and more a serious disappointment that we had to wait until the end of 3e to get our book, I buy it and get used to the new rules, then IMMEDIATELY we get an edition change that invalidates all of that. So I look at the rules for 4e and the core rules seem ok, but I'm not a big fan of the army rules, especially the loss of battalions, weapon choices and ranges, most good artifacts and traits, and the fact that there are only a couple models/units actually worth playing with. On top of that, while the index rules are decent to tide things over, it looks as though we'll still get our book at or near the end of 4th edition as well and the idea of playing with incomplete rules for the majority of the (very short!) edition lifespan doesn't appeal to me.

If the edition was going to last five years or so I'd be a lot more interested in learning it, but the idea of only having proper rules for the edition for a year or so kind of disgusts me, to be fully honest. I wasn't a big fan of the push to smaller armies and the loss of all of our shooting in 3e, but there were still a lot of things I liked about that edition and it got very well balanced by the end. The model range refresh was awesome and pretty much everything I ever wanted from a Seraphon update! (except for no new Temple Guard for some reason, lol!) And I'm sure that we'll probably get new Guard models and a new foot hero (probably just official rules for the return of the Sunblood from Underworlds) when the 4e book comes out, but right now I just don't feel motivated to play until the actual book comes out and even then I'm not going to buy it since it will only be useable for 12-18 months

 

[Killer Angel]

Sadly AoS discussion has seemed to have completely dried up.

It's also my fault. I was a constant contributor to that subforum, with various BatReps and writing a couple of our own "Seraphon handbook", completed with analysis of the units, tactics and so on.
Now I'm focused on 40k and TOW, i have barely a vague idea of what's happening in AoS. I cannot follow everything...

 

[Jason839]

In addition, Not much going on for seraphon at the moment. New ghb hit us pretty hard. We are one of the only factions that have to pay for our faction terrain, primary spell lore, and best artifact. then we have to pay for the good manifestations, as we don't have a faction specific one. our lists went up 80pts overnight. add to this our main man kroak has been seriously hindered by new obscurring, and everyone is struggling to figure things out.

we have a 41% win rate currently. one of the lowest in the game. id expect buffs in the balance patch but thats expected in a couple months. so until then, its kind of an awkward time.

 

[Kilvakar]

I don't know why GW has such a hard time balancing Lizardmen/Seraphon in AoS. It seems we're always either very overpowered like we were for a short time in 2nd or very underpowered. But yeah, from what I've seen the Lizards aren't in a good place right now. I'm not a big fan of obscuring terrain, it seems like an attempt to force players to hide everything in ruins like they do in 40k. But I guess it fits the trend of AoS and 40k slowly becoming more and more like each other, lol!

With the way 4e removed even more of our army's buffing capacity I can only hope that GW finally realizes that Seraphon actually need good warscrolls that can hold up to other faction's equivalent units without needing 3-4 buffs slapped on them

 

[Canas]

My misgiving with it is the constant release of books and editions... I feel no need to get into the rules, list building and playstyles if in a couple of years everything changes and I had just 3 or 4 games in.

I do like new models though, getting new models is always nice

Grrr, !mrahil

Yeah, AoS changes far too rapidly. And importantly, it changes far too drasticly. It basicly becomes a different game each edition, which is just exhausting to keep up with.

Also, far too often the changes throw out the baby with the bathwater, which isn't great.

GW seems to have made many of their games more abstract to make it better for tournament play, I assume. So, I'm sure that sours players who are more story-driven or flavor-driven.

Yeah, the focus on tournament play is really hurting the various games. The high level of abstraction means the games just don't really make narrative sense anymore. It's less of a fantasy "wargame" with semi-realistic depictions of knights and monsterscharging into eachother and more a game of chess, with abstract gamepieces whose moves only make sense in the context of the game but in no way still represents a battlefield.

I don't know why GW has such a hard time balancing Lizardmen/Seraphon in AoS

Cuz they keep insisting on designing the saurus & skink parts of our faction as two opposing subfactions with no internal synergy and opposite playstyles, but since they can potentially combined, one side being strong means the other needs to be nerfed.

This was the most obvious with summoning, where our stats were bad (cuz summoning) but summoning as a mechanic was limited to a specific subfaction which resulted in very odd balancing...

But it's also been visible in other things, like getting powerfull magic, cuz our stats are bad, but 99% of that magic is then for some reason poured into Kroak, so Kroak is OP (while say a starpriest has usually been rather underwhelming).

 

[Killer Angel]

Yeah, AoS changes far too rapidly. And importantly, it changes far too drasticly. It basicly becomes a different game each edition, which is just exhausting to keep up with.

Which is one of the reasons i'm not following it as i was before.

 

[Kilvakar]

Yeah, AoS changes far too rapidly. And importantly, it changes far too drasticly. It basicly becomes a different game each edition, which is just exhausting to keep up with.

Also, far too often the changes throw out the baby with the bathwater, which isn't great.

Which is one of the reasons i'm not following it as i was before.

This is how I've been feeling too. It's not very fun to only get a year or two with your actual army rules before the game changes entirely and you're forced to relearn everything. A 5-year edition life cycle would be much, much better than a 3-year one if you ask me.

 

[Canas]

This is how I've been feeling too. It's not very fun to only get a year or two with your actual army rules before the game changes entirely and you're forced to relearn everything. A 5-year edition life cycle would be much, much better than a 3-year one if you ask me.

Honestly, it'd be one thing if it was just the army rules that'd change. But even core mechanics aren't exactly stable.

Like I'd at least expect something like summoning, magic, or battalions, to work roughly the same across editions. But they've wildly changed over the years.

I just wish that they kept the core stable, and limited their seasonal nonsense to the tournament scene.

 

[Kilvakar]

Just curious, but how many people here are actively playing AoS 4e and/or The Old World? And if you are, are you enjoying it? What are some things you like/dislike about the current edition?

 

[Killer Angel]

Just curious, but how many people here are actively playing AoS 4e and/or The Old World? And if you are, are you enjoying it? What are some things you like/dislike about the current edition?

TOW here.
I will elaborate in depth in the next few days