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GW News: LAS VEGAS OPEN 2025

Canas said:
Isn't the "everything as a service" business model just great?
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Not happy to see Games Workshop go down this path. Definitely not customer orientated.
 
J.Logan said:
*looks pointedly at my rulebooks for Kings of War, and the OnePageRules file on my PC*

Or I can swap to a ruleset where I'm not getting jerked around by the ones that made those same rules? How is it that people in positions of power become so braindead as to not register that consumers aren't idiots? Wait... don't answer that... it's positive reinforcement; they jerk the consumers and the consumers are still frothing at the bit to spend their moneys.
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People don't like change; once locked into a particular brand/game/whatever, they're unlikely to change. If you make it artificially harder to change, by creating vendor lock-in they'll be even less likely to change. Especially when it's a subjective product, that encourages emotional ties, and is highly reliant on personal preferences, like games. There's a whole bunch of psychological (and a few non-psychological) barriers at play that stop you from switching.

It's why XaaS works so stupidly well as a businessmodel; it basicly does its best to maximize those (psychological) exit-barriers while making it as easy as possible to start using the product/brand/whatever.

On the flipside; it's also why convincing the existing users to switch to the new fancier version of your product of something can be very hard. As evident by dear @NIGHTBRINGER stubbornly holding onto 8th, no matter what :p.
 
Canas said:
On the flipside; it's also why convincing the existing users to switch to the new fancier version of your product of something can be very hard. As evident by dear @NIGHTBRINGER stubbornly holding onto 8th, no matter what :p.
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AoS is fancier? Not sure what is so fancy about a watered-down game that is significantly less intellectually demanding than its predecessor.

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I'm not stubbornly holding onto 8th "no matter what". I'm holding onto it until something better comes along. Since nothing better has appeared, I stick with the best. :cool:
 
NIGHTBRINGER said:
AoS is fancier? Not sure what is so fancy about a watered-down game that is significantly less intellectually demanding than its predecessor.

I'm not stubbornly holding onto 8th "no matter what". I'm holding onto it until something better comes along. Since nothing better has appeared, I stick with the best. :cool:
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Oof... I can feel the disdain.

I've said it in the past, I'll say it again, AoS's biggest issue was that it was always intended as a replacement, whereas (ignoring the stupid prank that was first/release edition) if the ruleset had just been released as "the skirmish-based alternative ruleset", without destroying the Old World, I honestly feel that it would have gotten much less flak, while also being the gateway with a cheaper buy-in price. Or maybe it would be more accurate to call it the "company level ruleset" where Fantasy Battles was "the regiment level ruleset"? Since skirmish is usually associated with Mordheim, Warcry and the like.

I enjoy AoS, what little chances I had to play it, and definitely appreciated the fact that I wasn't required to buy a literal hundred models for an army. And I have come to like the setting to a degree, the open nature of the Realms being so vast as to actually feel like you can create your own patch of it without it being a contradiction to canon, but I will never like the fact that they blew up the old setting for it. The Old World with its clear borders give more intimate stakes but is also set in stone, the Realms with its openness feels more narratively open for you to tell your own stories with their own geographical and political stakes.
 
J.Logan said:
Oof... I can feel the disdain.
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Is it that obvious? :D:p

J.Logan said:
ignoring the stupid prank that was first/release edition
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That was a real shit show. What an insult to the consumer base. Oddly enough, I remember people back in the day trying to defend that farce of a game. Even I openly admit that modern day AoS is significantly better than the earliest edition before the first general's handbook dropped.

J.Logan said:
I've said it in the past, I'll say it again, AoS's biggest issue was that it was always intended as a replacement, whereas (ignoring the stupid prank that was first/release edition) if the ruleset had just been released as "the skirmish-based alternative ruleset", without destroying the Old World, I honestly feel that it would have gotten much less flak, while also being the gateway with a cheaper buy-in price. Or maybe it would be more accurate to call it the "company level ruleset" where Fantasy Battles was "the regiment level ruleset"? Since skirmish is usually associated with Mordheim, Warcry and the like.
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I think your analysis is spot on. As a replacement, AoS garnered instant hatred from a significant portion of the fan base. If it had simply been released as a new and simpler game aimed at less experienced players or those players wishing for a quicker more streamlined game, I think it would have been much better received.
 
NIGHTBRINGER said:
AoS is fancier?
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It's the new "fancy" product. In the same way that windows 11 is the new "fancy" windows, and the iphone 15 is the current "fancy" iphone.
That does not mean it's necessarily better than the previous version (in fact; a lot of current "new fancy" versions really freaking suck....). It's just the new fancy thing they want you to buy.

NIGHTBRINGER said:
I'm not stubbornly holding onto 8th "no matter what". I'm holding onto it until something better comes along. Since nothing better has appeared, I stick with the best. :cool:
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The point is that the same psychological mechanisms that stop a player from switching to KoW from AoS also play a role in stopping a player from switching from 8th to AoS. The new product being better (or worse) is secondary to those psychological barriers.

Very simply put; if you already like the current thing, you'll need to be convinced to even consider trying the new thing. The current thing always has that very basic, but significant, advantage.

NIGHTBRINGER said:
I think your analysis is spot on. As a replacement, AoS garnered instant hatred from a significant portion of the fan base.
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Case and point. The fact that AoS was presented as an replacement, and not as an alternative game-mode or something, already made it unappealing to you (and others). You just wanted more WHF; not something new/different. The fact that you also think it's worse just cemented that initial disinterest.
 
Canas said:
It's the new "fancy" product. In the same way that windows 11 is the new "fancy" windows, and the iphone 15 is the current "fancy" iphone.
That does not mean it's necessarily better than the previous version (in fact; a lot of current "new fancy" versions really freaking suck....). It's just the new fancy thing they want you to buy.


The point is that the same psychological mechanisms that stop a player from switching to KoW from AoS also play a role in stopping a player from switching from 8th to AoS. The new product being better (or worse) is secondary to those psychological barriers.

Very simply put; if you already like the current thing, you'll need to be convinced to even consider trying the new thing. The current thing always has that very basic, but significant, advantage.


Case and point. The fact that AoS was presented as an replacement, and not as an alternative game-mode or something, already made it unappealing to you (and others). You just wanted more WHF; not something new/different. The fact that you also think it's worse just cemented that initial disinterest.
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Fair enough. I can't say that I disagree with any of that.
 
I think so as well.
Not sure what weapon the Bull Centaurs wield, thinking of a giant axe/hammer.

Knuckle duster could easily be removed and another hand weapon added

Grrr, !mrahil
 
You'd probably want a different weapon. Knuckle duster is a bit silly for eh... cavalry? But other than that it doesn't look like it'd need any converting to look good for a battlefield.
 
Canas said:
You'd probably want a different weapon. Knuckle duster is a bit silly for eh... cavalry? But other than that it doesn't look like it'd need any converting to look good for a battlefield.
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Ride-by punches. While the enemy isn't looking, they trot up, tap their enemies on the shoulders and sock 'em in the jaw as they turn around, then gallop away giggling.

But in seriousness, I think a heavy double-headed axe would work wonders for them. Just swing it low while galloping past, cleave down the foe and be gone before their comrades have a chance to react.
 
J.Logan said:
Ride-by punches. While the enemy isn't looking, they trot up, tap their enemies on the shoulders and sock 'em in the jaw as they turn around, then gallop away giggling.
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Clearly it's a stealthy rogue type character, sneaking up on enemies unnoticed :p
 
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