AoS steg with skink chief

[Slikus Vaw]

im sure this has been asked but don't want to dig through the forum. so when the steg with the skink chief has the prime warbeast command trait and with the sunfire throwers do it make double the attacks? since originally the sunfire throwers have one attack then it gets an additional attack or does it just add one attack after the "how many models there are within 8"?"

 

[Erta Wanderer]

im sure this has been asked but don't want to dig through the forum. so when the steg with the skink chief has the prime warbeast command trait and with the sunfire throwers do it make double the attacks? since originally the sunfire throwers have one attack then it gets an additional attack or does it just add one attack after the "how many models there are within 8"?"

it gets number of modes within 8"+1

 

[Slikus Vaw]

very unfortunate lol

 

[Nart]

it gets number of modes within 8"+1

Why? Gout of sunfire wording is following:

"Do not use the attack sequence for an attack
made with Sunfire Throwers. Instead, roll a
number of dice equal to the number of models"

Prime warbeast:

"Add 1 to the Attacks characteristic of the weapons
used by this general’s mount"

You do not make number of attacks, which equals to number of models. You make singe attack, which do not use standard sequence. Since prime warbeast increase attack characteristics by 1, you can execute it twice.

Even with this setup, I don't think Goads are worth it.

 

[Erta Wanderer]

Why? Gout of sunfire wording is following:

"Do not use the attack sequence for an attack
made with Sunfire Throwers. Instead, roll a
number of dice equal to the number of models"

Prime warbeast:

"Add 1 to the Attacks characteristic of the weapons
used by this general’s mount"

You do not make number of attacks, which equals to number of models. You make singe attack, which do not use standard sequence. Since prime warbeast increase attack characteristics by 1, you can execute it twice.

Even with this setup, I don't think Goads are worth it.

because that's how tournament judges are ruling it

 

[Nart]

because that's how tournament judges are ruling it

I wish tournament judges read the rules too once in a while.

 

[Erta Wanderer]

I wish tournament judges read the rules too once in a while.

it's more a judgement call then a not reading rules. the ability is clearly not meant to double the attack attribute that would be silly so they use other simuler abilities that are better written and work from there.

 

[xoid]

Saying it doubles the attacks makes no sense, as the thing doesn't have an attacks characteristic in the traditional sense. I'd say the two options are it does nothing, or adds one to the value that gets created by following the procure to create an attacks characteristic for that attack, and I'd lean towards the latter.

 

[PabloTho]

I was gonna disagree, then I read the warscroll and I think you're right.

Steg has 1 attack with the Sunfire thrower, which has the following rule:

"Do not use the attack sequence for an attack made with Sunfire throwers"

Rules as written, you would get to roll a dice per model within 8" for each attack with that profile.

Almost certainly not the intention, but it would be a fun little gimmick if it were allowed.

 

[Nart]

it's more a judgement call then a not reading rules. the ability is clearly not meant to double the attack attribute that would be silly so they use other simuler abilities that are better written and work from there.

Judges are not rule writers and they can't decide, what was clearly ment or not. When talk about bastiladons started, many people in my group said "it 100% is a bug and is not intended to work this way, it will be FAQed, you'll see". RAW is RAW.

And there is no way at all to interpret it as "one more dice rolled". It is either double number of rolls or don't apply PWB bonus to Goad at all. Because dice are rolled instead of attack sequance and have nothing to do with the attack characteristics. If you are homeruling anyway, just say that +1 attack don't apply to mount, because "lol, it should clearly be applied to dinosaur only".

Saying it doubles the attacks makes no sense, as the thing doesn't have an attacks characteristic in the traditional sense

Goad of Sunfire has an attack characteristics of 1.

 

[xoid]

Goad of Sunfire has an attack characteristics of 1.

Where? Because that sure isn't on the warscroll.

 

[Erta Wanderer]

Judges are not rule writers and they can't decide, what was clearly ment or not. When talk about bastiladons started, many people in my group said "it 100% is a bug and is not intended to work this way, it will be FAQed, you'll see". RAW is RAW.

bastiladons where Faqed stegs where not.

And there is no way at all to interpret it as "one more dice rolled". It is either double number of rolls or don't apply PWB bonus to Goad at all. Because dice are rolled instead of attack sequance and have nothing to do with the attack characteristics. If you are homeruling anyway, just say that +1 attack don't apply to mount, because "lol, it should clearly be applied to dinosaur only".

they are NOT home ruling it. they are ruling on a subject that is clearly confusing (as shown by how this thread exists at all) and that GW never addressed. and it's not just out of no where like your "can't work on a mount" nonsense. there are many other times where the rule works this way they just say it's consistent across the board

goad of Sunfire

gout not goad

 

[PabloTho]

Where? Because that sure isn't on the warscroll.

I just checked the app and the tome - both have the Sunfire Thrower has an Attacks characteristic of 1.

 

[Nart]

they are NOT home ruling it. they are ruling on a subject that is clearly confusing (as shown by how this thread exists at all) and that GW never addressed. and it's not just out of no where like your "can't work on a mount" nonsense. there are many other times where the rule works this way they just say it's consistent across the board

In this thread it is clearly presented how it works by RAW. It may be confusing from the first sight, but if you simply pay attention on the wordings, it is crystal clear. And what is homeruling if not playing the other way than clear RAW works?

 

[xoid]

I just checked the app and the tome - both have the Sunfire Thrower has an Attacks characteristic of 1.

I'm sorry I had been looking at this and the skaven warpfire thrower a few days ago and I misremembered that they both had see below for every part.

That makes me lean towards you roll two dice for each model within 8 inches. As one attack is one dice for everybody, and then the second attack would be another dice for everybody.