AoS line of sight

[Killer Angel]

True line of sight is such a terrible rule honestly, especially with people kitbashing/converting/proxying models and thats without considering people making fancy bases etc. There is no way people will accept you blocking line of sight because you put a tree, tall grass or whatever on your base.

Yeah, that's probably why terrains as awakened wyldwood explicitly negate los in their rules


Basically, there are only 2 ways in which a model is out of sight:
- rules for terrains / endless spells that dictate so
- the model cannot effectively be seen because it's behind a tower or something similar

 

[ILKAIN]

it's very fiddly though as most models aren't small enough to hide behind just 1 kroxigor. And the rules don't clearly state how partial LoS works. And kroxigor models leave quite large gaps between them, which can make it difficult to determine if they're hidden enough.

there is no such thing as "partial" line of sight. either you can see it or you cant.

 

[Canas]

there is no such thing as "partial" line of sight. either you can see it or you cant.

I'm fairly certain there was a F.A.Q, developer commentary or white dwarf article describing how you shouldn't be too strict about LoS; e.g. things like the very tip of a weapon poking out, although RAW make the model "visible" probably shouldn't be viewed as actually making the model visible due to that being a tad stupid as the models are merely basic representations of the creature and a reasonable assumption can be made that someone hiding behind a wall for cover isn't going to be standing with his sword raised into the sky trying to be taller than the wall for no particular reason. Assume they do things like crouch slightly, or at least try to hide behind cover if they can even slightly help it (e.g. a starpriest won't stretch out his hand when hiding behind a column, but a lord of change isn't going to be able to hide his wings as easily when hiding in the same manner)

The general advise was something along the lines of:

Torso clearly visible -> Clear LoS.
Only an appendage (partly) visible -> be practical, half a fraction of a nail on an outstretched hand, like our starpriest has, probably shouldn't count, seeing half of of a lord of change his wing would count as clear LoS.
Just a weapon, or a bit of decorative (but useless) armour like our starpriest feather's visible -> blocked LoS.

 

[ILKAIN]

I'm fairly certain there was a F.A.Q, developer commentary or white dwarf article describing how you shouldn't be too strict about LoS; e.g. things like the very tip of a weapon poking out, although RAW make the model "visible" probably shouldn't be viewed as actually making the model visible due to that being a tad stupid as the models are merely basic representations of the creature and a reasonable assumption can be made that someone hiding behind a wall for cover isn't going to be standing with his sword raised into the sky trying to be taller than the wall for no particular reason. Assume they do things like crouch slightly, or at least try to hide behind cover if they can even slightly help it (e.g. a starpriest won't stretch out his hand when hiding behind a column, but a lord of change isn't going to be able to hide his wings as easily when hiding in the same manner)

The general advise was something along the lines of:

Torso clearly visible -> Clear LoS.
Only an appendage (partly) visible -> be practical, half a fraction of a nail on an outstretched hand, like our starpriest has, probably shouldn't count, seeing half of of a lord of change his wing would count as clear LoS.
Just a weapon, or a bit of decorative (but useless) armour like our starpriest feather's visible -> blocked LoS.

correct and agreed, however right now, even taking the DC into consideration, whether you use the 40k 51% visible rule, the kill team torso rule, or any other rule to determine whether or not its visible, (as long as its consistent and fair to both players, or pre-determined by the TO) there is no distinction for partial line of sight. either its blocked or its not. 40k rules give big guys the cover save if a certain portion of their body is behind the terrain. THAT is (to me) a partial LOS rule... one that says well you can see it and attack, but there's gonna be interference. the closest to this we get is "look out sir", but that doesn't require the screening unit to be closer to the shooting unit than its target is as the cover rules do for 40k.

if you thought I meant something else, I apologize for the lack of clarity espoused in the brevity of my previous response

 

[Canas]

correct and agreed, however right now, even taking the DC into consideration, whether you use the 40k 51% visible rule, the kill team torso rule, or any other rule to determine whether or not its visible, (as long as its consistent and fair to both players, or pre-determined by the TO) there is no distinction for partial line of sight. either its blocked or its not. 40k rules give big guys the cover save if a certain portion of their body is behind the terrain. THAT is (to me) a partial LOS rule... one that says well you can see it and attack, but there's gonna be interference. the closest to this we get is "look out sir", but that doesn't require the screening unit to be closer to the shooting unit than its target is as the cover rules do for 40k.

if you thought I meant something else, I apologize for the lack of clarity espoused in the brevity of my previous response

ah, thought you meant that you're either completly hidden or not, and that things like weapons poking out thus "count". Sorry for misunderstanding

And yeah, I think I like the Lotr LoS rule best for partial LoS/Partial cover, for any object that's in the way and is at least ~50% of the targets size roll a dice, on a 1-2-3 you hit the obstacle whatever that may be, roll independently for every single obstacle. It's perfect for horde armies, and would help with protecting important units that aren't heroes in AoS and thus don't benefit from look-out sir (e.g. skaven weapon teams). Plus, even a single obstacle has a massive impact on accuracy this way, which makes it way easier to protect the super squishy support heroes from being annihlated whereas -1 to hit can be relativly irrelevant (let's be honest, what's -1 to hit going to do when 40 skinks shoot at you and you only have 5 wounds to begin with, however a 50% change of just flat out avoiding the attacks will have a massive impact ...)