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AoS 2k w/o battalions to bring pain

Paul Beenis
Cold One

Paul Beenis

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Finally settled on a decent 2k list to play against a really hard SCE list. List will have Protectors, Retributors, Vanguard Raptors, Liberators and lord Castellant plus others. I'm trialling no battalions with the principle of not having to take any tax units I actually don't want, and instead get more of the units I do want.

Key to list is drawing attention to my Dread Saurian to soak up damage while a sneaky 2 units of 4 Razordons (8 all up ;)) will teleport to snipe his delicate underbelly units ie: ones with 4+ saves. I know my opponent is bringing a unit of 9 vanguard raptors and from my rolling tests I think I can take out a significant amount of them in one round of TP+shoot them dead. I just have to be careful about aether wings and Gryph hounds he will likely have nearby.

One big blob of 40 Saurus and two blobs of 40 skinks I think will be invaluable against soaking up wounds and mortals.

Thoughts? Comments and criticism welcomed! I just wanna beat the list he thinks is unbeatable :D:D

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While I am not a huge fan of them most of the times, I believe you should definitely invest those last 40 points in skink handlers. I would anyway but now that you can even spare them, taking them is one way imho.
Giving -1 rend to 16d6 attacks will make a HUGE different on the impact as it cuts down his saving chances even more than a simple unit, due to them rerolling saves on 1 or 2 frequently !

Another thing it troubles me : What is the role of the 2 priests ? I think that they might not serve their points as much as they could being 2 in this list.
 
Seraphage said:
While I am not a huge fan of them most of the times, I believe you should definitely invest those last 40 points in skink handlers. I would anyway but now that you can even spare them, taking them is one way imho.
Giving -1 rend to 16d6 attacks will make a HUGE different on the impact as it cuts down his saving chances even more than a simple unit, due to them rerolling saves on 1 or 2 frequently !

Another thing it troubles me : What is the role of the 2 priests ? I think that they might not serve their points as much as they could being 2 in this list.
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I thought the 2 priests would be one behind the skinks the other behind the warriors to keep them buffed but I would like to see what @Paul Beenis idea is.
 
@Seraphage dont get me wrong! I would love to get the -1 more often for the Razors... But the handlers don't give that! Only when units are within 6" can you get that. But yeah would be worth even just to hold an objective I guess although with deep striking Retributors you would want a decent unit of something holding each objective until they come down.
 
Crowsfoot said:
I thought the 2 priests would be one behind the skinks the other behind the warriors to keep them buffed but I would like to see what @Paul Beenis idea is.
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When I thought this list up I wanted to get in bubble rerolling saves although now I think about it, it would only be worth it if I'm supporting the unit (most likely Saurus) with a mystic shield 4+ re-rollable ignore -1.

Way I see the troops;

40 Saurus: 40 annoying wounds that will bash on his shield wall, potentially doing more damage once I snipe units that will buff their save etc (Lord Castellant)

2x40 skinks: teleporting around swarming objectives and being a bit shooty.

Conclusion maybe my troop use here is a bit clumsy as I see them mostly as cannon fodder and objective grabbers/holders.

Thoughts? Reckon needs some more refinement? I've already got re-roll saves against shooting from Slann. And aim for re-roll1's to hit constellation. If I lost both skink priests what would you guys take instead?
 
Paul Beenis said:
Thoughts? Reckon needs some more refinement? I've already got re-roll saves against shooting from Slann. And aim for re-roll1's to hit constellation. If I lost both skink priests what would you guys take instead?
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4 more Razors
 
Paul Beenis said:
When I thought this list up I wanted to get in bubble rerolling saves although now I think about it, it would only be worth it if I'm supporting the unit (most likely Saurus) with a mystic shield 4+ re-rollable ignore -1.

Way I see the troops;

40 Saurus: 40 annoying wounds that will bash on his shield wall, potentially doing more damage once I snipe units that will buff their save etc (Lord Castellant)

2x40 skinks: teleporting around swarming objectives and being a bit shooty.

Conclusion maybe my troop use here is a bit clumsy as I see them mostly as cannon fodder and objective grabbers/holders.

Thoughts? Reckon needs some more refinement? I've already got re-roll saves against shooting from Slann. And aim for re-roll1's to hit constellation. If I lost both skink priests what would you guys take instead?
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- Wow I never used the razordons wrong and yet somehow I completely messed up while writing. You don't even need them due to Slanns' reroll constellation. I would still take them though just in case you 'll need another constellation at somepoint *although admittedly you shouldn't as the 40man blob would be seviously nerfed without it*

- "..When I thought this list up I wanted to get in bubble rerolling saves although now I think about it, it would only be worth it if I'm supporting the unit (most likely Saurus) with a mystic shield 4+ re-rollable ignore -1." Exactly, this is the only way you should judging by my battles. If you do invest to a priest, then mystic shield is autolock on the warriors until their first engagement. After that, most of their output will already have burst and it won't matter as much. It;s just that I thought you might needed on the Dread Saurian or w/e.

Although I do agree with your plan. What you need in an efficient army is at least 2 big threats.
If you manage to protect the blob until its first encountment, then you have 2.5 big threats. The blob, the Saurian and the Razordons. And then you have mobility. I actually like this list on paper a lot and would definitely try it at tournament if I had enough razordons.
 
Seraphage said:
- Wow I never used the razordons wrong and yet somehow I completely messed up while writing. You don't even need them due to Slanns' reroll constellation. I would still take them though just in case you 'll need another constellation at somepoint *although admittedly you shouldn't as the 40man blob would be seviously nerfed without it*

- "..When I thought this list up I wanted to get in bubble rerolling saves although now I think about it, it would only be worth it if I'm supporting the unit (most likely Saurus) with a mystic shield 4+ re-rollable ignore -1." Exactly, this is the only way you should judging by my battles. If you do invest to a priest, then mystic shield is autolock on the warriors until their first engagement. After that, most of their output will already have burst and it won't matter as much. It;s just that I thought you might needed on the Dread Saurian or w/e.

Although I do agree with your plan. What you need in an efficient army is at least 2 big threats.
If you manage to protect the blob until its first encountment, then you have 2.5 big threats. The blob, the Saurian and the Razordons. And then you have mobility. I actually like this list on paper a lot and would definitely try it at tournament if I had enough razordons.
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Good calls here! If I get re-rolls to save from Slann in shooting phase then Saurus are protected until first engagement so mystic shield would be worth it in the warrior blob. After that it would likely go to the dread Saurian/Slann depending on how thing pan out.

If I drop both priests and get handlers for 40 I could also pick up 4 salamanders to combo TP both sallies and handlers into shooting range against his tougher troops. That gives me more flexibility than another group of razors.

Thoughts on sequencing events??

I aim to get both razors in shooting his Raptors as soon as possibly (if they are unprotected on 4+ saves). I would likely nee to pull them out again next turn, so double TP out. Or leave then in as a threat from the flank/ rear and port in warriors/skinks and dread Saurian to get the charge the following turn unless I'm lucky on TP rolls. Sallies and handlers could port in whenever really needed. Bottom line I don't want to Rambo dead Saurian in without support so he'll either have to run in with warriors/skinks or port in together.

Thanks for the compliment on the list building :D has been my biggest struggle as I want to build good lists that will compete against hard armies. I'm rarely happy with the direction they take, and I kinda like this so far!
 
Paul Beenis said:
Good calls here! If I get re-rolls to save from Slann in shooting phase then Saurus are protected until first engagement so mystic shield would be worth it in the warrior blob. After that it would likely go to the dread Saurian/Slann depending on how thing pan out.

If I drop both priests and get handlers for 40 I could also pick up 4 salamanders to combo TP both sallies and handlers into shooting range against his tougher troops. That gives me more flexibility than another group of razors.

Thoughts on sequencing events??

I aim to get both razors in shooting his Raptors as soon as possibly (if they are unprotected on 4+ saves). I would likely nee to pull them out again next turn, so double TP out. Or leave then in as a threat from the flank/ rear and port in warriors/skinks and dread Saurian to get the charge the following turn unless I'm lucky on TP rolls. Sallies and handlers could port in whenever really needed. Bottom line I don't want to Rambo dead Saurian in without support so he'll either have to run in with warriors/skinks or port in together.

Thanks for the compliment on the list building :D has been my biggest struggle as I want to build good lists that will compete against hard armies. I'm rarely happy with the direction they take, and I kinda like this so far!
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This makes your list even stronger and you now actually managed to have 3 serious threats - I think I never managed this so far.
What left to do now is to be careful on positioning and even more : do not overextend. The double tp is a huge weapon but a double edged one. If you get overly excited and teleport your units before the right time, you'll be sacrificing one of your threats. Be patient for the right moment - don't just tp them in, attack and then lose them to your opponents' coutner attack :D
 
@Seraphage yeah I agree. One really cool part about the teleport is you can grab them from anywhere. So vulnerable units could be in terrain cover prior to porting! Also denying areas for him to deep strike. It will be hard for sure as I'll be itching to kill his nasty units asap but yeah being patient will hopefully let me take them out when he makes a mistake and keep the units alive.

I'm thinking I would want to go second so I can see what he buffs/ deep strikes and moves etc do I can be the most reactive :cool:
 
Paul Beenis said:
@Seraphage yeah I agree. One really cool part about the teleport is you can grab them from anywhere. So vulnerable units could be in terrain cover prior to porting! Also denying areas for him to deep strike. It will be hard for sure as I'll be itching to kill his nasty units asap but yeah being patient will hopefully let me take them out when he makes a mistake and keep the units alive.

I'm thinking I would want to go second so I can see what he buffs/ deep strikes and moves etc do I can be the most reactive :cool:
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To be honest, excluding some really specific lists, it feels like going 2nd worths it more in the majority of fights. I am looking forward to a battlereport to tell us how it turned out !
 
@Seraphage will do one! Also I just read that the Dread Saurian doesn't have the "monster" keyword so I'll definitely be exploiting that for the 2+ re-rollable saves before I bring him into combat if I need to :D
 
Haha well as an opponent I would take that lack of FAQ a bit bitter, so I'd suggest to only do it at rude opponents as it doesn't make sense with this HUGE size of his ! :p:D
 
Paul Beenis said:
Finally settled on a decent 2k list to play against a really hard SCE list. List will have Protectors, Retributors, Vanguard Raptors, Liberators and lord Castellant plus others. I'm trialling no battalions with the principle of not having to take any tax units I actually don't want, and instead get more of the units I do want.

Key to list is drawing attention to my Dread Saurian to soak up damage while a sneaky 2 units of 4 Razordons (8 all up ;)) will teleport to snipe his delicate underbelly units ie: ones with 4+ saves. I know my opponent is bringing a unit of 9 vanguard raptors and from my rolling tests I think I can take out a significant amount of them in one round of TP+shoot them dead. I just have to be careful about aether wings and Gryph hounds he will likely have nearby.

One big blob of 40 Saurus and two blobs of 40 skinks I think will be invaluable against soaking up wounds and mortals.

Thoughts? Comments and criticism welcomed! I just wanna beat the list he thinks is unbeatable :D:D

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Hey mate how did you go with the game at GW Cairns the other day... Sorry I couldn't stay around to see the ending.... sorry disregard this comment, didn't read the whole thread prior to commenting....
 
JohnnyH5 said:
Hey mate how did you go with the game at GW Cairns the other day... Sorry I couldn't stay around to see the ending.... sorry disregard this comment, didn't read the whole thread prior to commenting....
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Haha all good it's annoying you can't delete posts! Yeah hopefully you like the battle report :)
 
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