AoS Hothead Gamer Flips Out, Burns Warhammer Fantasy Army

[Hyperborean]

@Rikard exceptionally well spoken if I could like that post twice I would.

While it is his stuff to do as he wishes I kind of hoped he'd have given AoS a chance. Who knows it may not be all that bad once everything is fully released and I am looking for to trying it but also playing more 8th as well. Its not like everyone is going to switch so he'd have no problem finding anyone playing that edition.

 

[Rikard]

@Hyperborean

Much obliged, thank you.
Never understood peoples aversion with change, admittedly AOS is huge on that front, but I think hope is something that is a good thing here, with GW actually committing staff at warhammer world events and the like just to gather feedback, well, that to be is definitely a good sign.

 

[Mr Phat]

For perspective on how insignificant said changes are on a cosmic scale, heres a video of Star touching a black holes event horizon.

 

[Caprasauridae]

Never understood these rage-quitters. Like people who throw their PS4s out of the window because they can't beat Bloobourne, or trash their screens because Counter Strike lagged. But I think @Deusvult made a great notion about all publicity being good publicity. By this outburst, he most likely did much much more good to GW than he had by selling his army on eBay. But he is living his 15 minutes now, 100 000 views is a nice number. And, in my opinion, it's much more entertaining to burn your miniatures than your Magic the Gathering cards...

 

[NIGHTBRINGER]

Never understood peoples aversion with change, admittedly AOS is huge on that front, but I think hope is something that is a good thing here

While I can personally understand an aversion to change, I don't believe that is the central issue here. It's not that there have been changes... it's not even that the changes are very large... it's that fact that the changes are for the worse. Simply put, in terms of complexity, strategic requirements and completeness AoS is inferior to Warhammer. So the problem is that they discontinued Warhammer and replaced it with a shadow of its former self in AoS. While I agree that nothing stops us from playing 8th (which is what I intend to do), many people are hesitant continuing with a discontinued system that slowly heads towards extinction. Personally, I'm surprised that so many people have flocked to AoS just because it is the newest and shiniest thing available. I have yet to hear a logical argument that outlines how AoS is superior to Warhammer. I feel players should only change systems if the new system is at the very least equal to (but preferably better) than the old one.

Of course I am in no way trying to justify the burning of his army; it is something I would never do.

 

[NIGHTBRINGER]

By this outburst, he most likely did much much more good to GW than he had by selling his army on eBay

Personally I don't feel his outburst will have any significant impact (positive or negative) on AoS sales.

 

[Ixt]

Simply put, in terms of complexity, strategic requirements and completeness AoS is inferior to Warhammer.

What makes you say that? Have you played a lot of games? It just runs counter to my experience, is all... I've found that this game's got more depth than is immediately apparent. It'll become even deeper with scenarios, I imagine.

I have yet to hear a logical argument that outlines how AoS is superior to Warhammer.

I mean no offense, but no matter how well the point's made, it's still just a matter of opinion on both sides. If you can't be convinced by that, then you can't be convinced at all.

 

[Caprasauridae]

Personally I don't feel his outburst will have any significant impact (positive or negative) on AoS sales.

That might be the case, it really depends what kind of people saw the video. But, it, together with AoS, was featured on a board game blog called Shut Up & Sit Down, who probably has a wide audience that don't know much about AoS. Those just might get curious enough to see what this Age of Sigmar is.

 

[NIGHTBRINGER]

Simply put, in terms of complexity, strategic requirements and completeness AoS is inferior to Warhammer.

What makes you say that? Have you played a lot of games? It just runs counter to my experience, is all... I've found that this game's got more depth than is immediately apparent. It'll become even deeper with scenarios, I imagine.

Complexity:

• 100+ pages worth of rules versus 4 pages
• Character creation (magic items etc.) in 8th edition was significantly more complex in comparison to AoS' straight out of the box approach

Strategic requirements:

• AoS magic phase is a complete joke in comparison to that of 8th edition. 8th edition magic was a mini game in its own right
  
• Movement phase required far more thought and skill to master in 8th

Completeness:

• no points system in AoS
• AoS is difficult to play properly without an externally created balancing system

I mean no offense, but no matter how well the point's made, it's still just a matter of opinion on both sides.

No offense taken at all. Some of it comes down to opinion, while some of it is built upon facts. The completeness advantage held by 8th edition is pretty much a fact. In terms of complexity, it's pretty much a fact that 8th is more complex, but some people may prefer a more simplistic game... which is opinion. Which game someone likes better is based purely on opinion. However there is usually some sort of justification behind that opinion, I have yet to hear a good one on the side of AoS (which is of course my opinion).

That might be the case, it really depends what kind of people saw the video. But, it, together with AoS, was featured on a board game blog called Shut Up & Sit Down, who probably has a wide audience that don't know much about AoS. Those just might get curious enough to see what this Age of Sigmar is.

Some people might be intrigued to look into further, while others may be turned off straight away. In either case, the numbers are microscopic in the grand scheme of GW's operations... like a drop in the ocean.

 

[Ixt]

Well... I disagree with every bulletpoint on that list because they run exactly counter to my too-many-games-for-my-own-good experience, but more power to ya.

 

[n810]

"100+ pages worth of rules versus 4 pages"
to be fair, you probably could have compress the old rules to about 10 pages,
by just using less narrative text and less random pictures.

 

[Scalenex]

"100+ pages worth of rules versus 4 pages"
to be fair, you probably could have compress the old rules to about 10 pages,
by just using less narrative text and less random pictures.

The 8th ed brb could have easily done with a trim. Lots of things that didn't need to be there. Special abilities that were rarely used could be regulated to army books. There was only one creature in all of 8th ed that had Sea Creature and it was in a Forge World book.

GW took a good idea "Make Warhammer simpler" and took it to an extreme.

It's like a car manufacturer decided their last car was a gas guzzler so they decided to give their customer a pair of hiking boots and call it a "fuel efficient car substitute"

 

[borkbork]

It's like a car manufacturer decided their last car was a gas guzzler so they decided to give their customer a pair of hiking boots and call it a "fuel efficient car substitute"

Nice comparison

And it is like a car munufacturer with a historical name, like Ferrari,, who also tosses away his/her great history and decides to call those shoes Fiats.

 

[NIGHTBRINGER]

Well... I disagree with every bulletpoint on that list because they run exactly counter to my too-many-games-for-my-own-good experience, but more power to ya.

How many 8th edition games have you played? How can you claim that AoS is on par with 8th edition in terms of movement and magic strategy?

"100+ pages worth of rules versus 4 pages"
to be fair, you probably could have compress the old rules to about 10 pages,
by just using less narrative text and less random pictures.

I agree that the 8th edition rules could have been compressed, but I don't believe it could be reduced to anywhere near 10 pages.

 

[Ixt]

How many 8th edition games have you played? How can you claim that AoS is on par with 8th edition in terms of movement and magic strategy?

Not enough of either to express my opinion as fact, unfortunately. However, having played both games extensively - though, admittedly, not as much AoS as 8th - I personally believe that AoS is on par, yes.

 

[Pinktaco]

"100+ pages worth of rules versus 4 pages"
to be fair, you probably could have compress the old rules to about 10 pages,
by just using less narrative text and less random pictures.

It's true. A LOT could've been done and still been in the spirit of the old game. It could very easily have been more simpler, trimmed down and straight forward. In fact they could've taken 8th edition and given it a slim edition + a bit extra new (changes to magic, cannons, deathstars etc), released it for free and released all stats for all units for free.

Boom

They could've kept everything and still made it way more accessible.

Their last focus would then be to create more "elite" armies that wouldn't require many models. Then you'd have: a cheaper game (free rules/stats), less to paint (more "elite" armies) and an easier game without it being dumbed too much down and yet being accessible.

But nooooooo.. Let's cut the crap AND the good things.

 

[Hyperborean]

I guess part of me is hoping regardless of the quality of AoS that it gets more people into the game and generates more interest in Warhammer as a whole, while I wish it was not made this much easier. Basically they pulled a 4th ed Dungeons and Dragons with this.4th got me in the door but 3.5 I liked a bit better and from then on I become more dedicated. DnD aside and back to Warhammer, I think that is possibly wishful thinking here but hey if it gets us new folks, and good ones at that, I won't be complaining. Unless AoS is really horrible when I play it, then I will be complaining.

 

[n810]

I duno Guys I had a series of cheat sheets that covered most rules.
4 pages for turn order and shooting/combat charts, movement and basic rules,
1 page for terrain,
2 page for magic spells
1 page for BRB weapons, armor and items.
1 page for scenarios.

seems entirely possible.

 

[pendrake]

It's like a car manufacturer decided their last car was a gas guzzler so they decided to give their customer a pair of hiking boots and call it a "fuel efficient car substitute"

That's a little extreme. I might have gone with trading in a 12 cylinder Duesenberg for a Tricycle.

 

[Fhanados]

A friend of mine told me about this video. I refuse to watch it.

Yes, it's his own property to do with as he pleases but it was such a petty, immature, impulsive act that done nothing but hurt the gaming community as a whole.

It's this kind of negativity that fuels flame wars in the wagaming community online.
It's this kind of extreme behaviour that paints the image of wargamers being intense, excessive, immature social outcasts.
People often say that GW doesn't take the community seriously, and this kind of infantile nerd rage is why.

Rikard has already said it better than I possibly could, so I'll leave it at this