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AoS Why didn't this Shadowstrike List work?

Leo Finighan
Skink

Leo Finighan

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Hi guys, I'm new to the game but loving Seraphon so far. I hated the idea of running a Skink heavy army until I read about how effective the Shadowstrike battalion can be. I recently played a casual game of ~1500pts with a friend (who played Sylvaneth), and it went terribly. Here is my list:

Allegiance: Seraphon

Leaders
Lord Kroak (450)
- General
- Trait: Lord of Space and Time
Skink Starpriest (80)
- Artefact: Light of Dracothion

Units
5 x Chameleon Skinks (120)
3 x Kroxigor (160)
- 1 x Moonhammer
3 x Ripperdactyls (140)
20 x Skinks (120)
- Javelins and Starbucklers

Behemoths
Stegadon (220)

Battalions
Shadowstrike Starhost (180)

Endless Spells
Balewind Vortex (40)

Are there any warning signs there for any of you or should that have performed fine? Kroak was almost immediately shot to death by Kurnoth Hunters (who dealt around 18 wounds in one shooting phase!), and my Rippers were disappointing, only just killing one Kurnoth Hunter on their only opportunity to charge in and attack before being annihilated.

I'd love to be able to make this Starhost work in Matched / Competitive play too, at either 1000pts or 2000pts. What edits should I make and what additions would suit it best? Thank you so much in advance :)
 
I would take a regular Slann Starmaster instead of Kroak with Shadowstrike. Giving your Slann anyone of the -1 to be hit artifacts is always nice. Withg the extra points left over from Kroak now being a reg Slann you should grab an Astrolith. Having a Saurus Astrolith Bearer with help with the long game by providing additional Celestial Conjuration points and acts as a force multiplayer by allowing your 40man Skink Blob rerolls with Proud Defiance. In lower Matched play points games I always advise on the inclusion on Razordons.

At 1500 my Shadowstrike Starhost would look something like this:

Allegiance: Seraphon
- Mortal Realm: Ghur

LEADERS:
Slann Starmaster (260)
- General
- Command Trait : Great Rememberer
- Artefact : Gryph-feather Charm
Saurus Astrolith Bearer (160)
Skink Starpriest (80)

UNITS:
6 x Ripperdactyl Riders (280)
40 x Skinks (240)
-Boltspitters & Star Bucklers
10 x Skinks (60)
-Meteoric Javelins & Star Bucklers
4 x Razordons (160)
3 x Skink Handlers (40)

BATTALIONS:
Shadowstrike Starhost (180)

ENDLESS SPELLS:
Balewind Vortex (40)

TOTAL: 1500/1500

You could drop the Balewind and Handlers to free up 80 points, but I just didn't feel the normal priest merited the inclusion.
 
First of all, a shadowstrike should try to include at least 6 rippers.
I only own 3 of them, but currently you really need those additional beaks…

Secondly, there are units that shoot as hell, and kurhoth hunters are amongst them. If you face sylvaneth, you should have at hand something to protect the Slann (a bunch of skinks for Look Out Sir, and possibly an Eternity Warden as bodyguard)
 
LizardWizard & Killer Angel - thanks for the advice! I will invest in more Rippers for certain. As for the Kurnoth Hunters - are there any other ways to take them out or nullify their threat besides just soaking up their damage with other models like Skinks and Eternity Wardens? My opponent just sat them in a Wildwood and pew-pewed me to death :/

Dr Kaos - He has 2 units of 3 Bow Kurnoths, and 1 unit of Scyth Kurnoths. He was able to teleport them around the battlefield (with Wyldwoods) and basically sit them within cover and line of sight of the entire map. It felt unbeatable! If I were to charge them with Rippers or any tough melee, the bonuses from the Wyldwood made a melee fight pyrrhic at best, and when I eventually shot one down, they came back next turn because of one of Sylvaneth's regrowth battalion abilities.
 
His citadel woods block his own line of sight if they are more than 1" deep on the Wildwoods. It is not for certain, but he could have been misplaying. He shouldn't be able to easily gain line of slight for the whole battlefield. Send your monsters into the woods. They ignore the charge and movement rules for the woods. His rouse the woods will still work though.However, a Bastiladon should be able to weather the woods a few turns.

Durring the early turn try to spread your skinks is such a manner that he will have a difficult time placing newly summoned woods effectively :D
 
LizardWizard said:
His citadel woods block his own line of sight if they are more than 1" deep on the Wildwoods. It is not for certain, but he could have been misplaying. He shouldn't be able to easily gain line of slight for the whole battlefield. Send your monsters into the woods. They ignore the charge and movement rules for the woods. His rouse the woods will still work though.However, a Bastiladon should be able to weather the woods a few turns.

Durring the early turn try to spread your skinks is such a manner that he will have a difficult time placing newly summoned woods effectively :D
Click to expand...
He was basically propping them on the edge of the Woods, making it so that if I engaged them in melee, he could activate Rouse the Woods, while also gaining the benefits his Wyldwoods grant to nearby Sylvaneth units (extra attack for some, -1 to hit for others etc, I lost count). I didn't think of using the monsters to ignore the perilous movement though, and spreading Skinks about to block placement is a really good idea! I'll try that in my next game, thank you for all the advice :D
 
First thing is "Lords of space and time" is an allegiance ability not something you put on Kroak so you can always attempt to teleport 1 unit a turn. Great rememberer on a Slann allows you to do it twice (while he is alive)

Since the last FAQ Kroak took a massive hit and is very hard to make work even buffing him as best we can in a 2k in anything less he's pretty much a no go for his points.

Like others have said rippers should go in a block of at least 6, especially if you are investing in the shadowstrike for them.

Also you don't have enough battleline in the list you shared. in 1k you need 2 and for 2k lists you'll need 3. Skinks are probably going to be your go to battleline, even better since you can take them in the battalion and make use of the post setup extra move.
 
Stevie754 said:
First thing is "Lords of space and time" is an allegiance ability not something you put on Kroak so you can always attempt to teleport 1 unit a turn. Great rememberer on a Slann allows you to do it twice (while he is alive)

Since the last FAQ Kroak took a massive hit and is very hard to make work even buffing him as best we can in a 2k in anything less he's pretty much a no go for his points.

Like others have said rippers should go in a block of at least 6, especially if you are investing in the shadowstrike for them.

Also you don't have enough battleline in the list you shared. in 1k you need 2 and for 2k lists you'll need 3. Skinks are probably going to be your go to battleline, even better since you can take them in the battalion and make use of the post setup extra move.
Click to expand...
Thanks Stevie - I have since realised how inefficient Kroak can be for points, and I've stuck to a Slann Starmaster for each game since :P I know the battleline wasn't met, but that's because it was a casual game and not a matched play one, as said in the original post.
 
Lord Kroak is Still viable. He even still fairs alright in Tournaments, but he does require a great deal of understanding to use well. Meaning you need to have a plan for each map. Balancing summoning with his Damage spells is Crucial. Casting Palisade with your Skink Starpriest first turn instead of Cogs will go a long ways to keeping him alive.

Here is the Kroak List I built for when I want to field our favorite mummified frog:

Allegiance: Seraphon
- Mortal Realm: Ghur

LEADERS:
Lord Kroak (450)
- General
Saurus Astrolith Bearer (160)
Skink Starpriest (80)
- Artefact : Gryph-feather Charm
Engine of the Gods (220)
Engine of the Gods (220)
Engine of the Gods (220)

UNITS:
4 x Razordons (160)
40 x Skinks (240)
-Boltspitters & Star Bucklers
10 x Skinks (60)
-Boltspitters & Star Bucklers
10 x Skinks (60)
-Boltspitters & Star Bucklers

ENDLESS SPELLS:
Balewind Vortex (40)
Chronomantic Cogs (60)
Prismatic Palisade (30)

TOTAL: 2000/2000
 
im working on treating Kroak like a melee baddass... he basically is with a 4+ save, unlimited self healing if not destroyed out right, and 10 inches of range on what amounts to a mortal wound dealing melee attack.
 
Leo Finighan said:
LizardWizard & Killer Angel - thanks for the advice! I will invest in more Rippers for certain. As for the Kurnoth Hunters - are there any other ways to take them out or nullify their threat besides just soaking up their damage with other models like Skinks and Eternity Wardens? My opponent just sat them in a Wildwood and pew-pewed me to death :/
Click to expand...

Unless we're talking about a large number of kurnoth, i would say to blast them with mortal wounds.
Target them with Kroak's comet and the d6 from an EotG.
Running Kroak with triple engine should give your opponent something to think about, after you wipe them away in one turn.
 
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