8th Ed. Special characters: yay or nay?

[lordkingcrow]

Do you use special characters in your gaming groups? Just figured I'd get a feel for how you guys view this topic. Personally, I have never cared for running them. I enjoy the fluff, and it's always fun to compare them with others, but they just don't have a lot of appeal for me. In my gaming group we make it a house rule that we have to make our own lords and heroes. There have been a few occasions in which we try out the character, but we let the other person know if we are running a pre-made character so they can do the same. I've always just made my own anyway. I've always enjoyed making characters and seeing what works. What do you all think or do?

 

[NexS1]

Gor-Rok is a pleb killing beast.
I also always take him if my DE playing friend takes a chariot (for nostalgia reasons!)

Kroq-Gar is the only way i'll take a carnosaur

Kroak is fun. He takes the chance out of combat for my beloved TG

I like them

 

[MHK Pathfinder]

I say yay!

While I love running no-character lists for fluff reasons, I do use characters fairly regularly.

I love dropping Gor-rok in a unit of saurus or TG. Not only does he wreck face, but he makes a combat block stubborn, which for well under 200 points is pretty awesome.

I also like Tetto, because it lets you play a whole different type of warhammer with D3 vanguarding units. I'm still experimenting with him, but I have some really fun lists I've built around denying the enemy vanguards with Chameleons and then vanguarding 2-3 units to completely dominate the battlefield, territory-wise.

 

[teufelhund]

I say yea as well. They just add a different dimension to the game. If I can make a clone for less points pretty much determines wether or not I think they are worthwhile.

 

[n810]

yep and forge world models too. ...

 

[NexS1]

in addition... why is chakax so old but only has a 5+ scaly skin?
Why, i say. Why?

 

[Sealterbloind]

I'd say YAY ! \o/

The only Special Character I have used is Tetto'eko, but he has worked very well and has some pretty neat things for 185pts. I'd also like to run Chakax more than anything since he is my favourite SC and I really love that model, but I haven't been able to do a good list where he would fit. :/ I have already a list with Tehenhauin as my lord, but I don't have enough swarms to play that yet ^^" Chakax and Tehenhauin are my favs <3 Would also be nice to use Kroak and Gor-Rok sometime :3

The only SC I'm not so interested to use is Oxyotl, and I see hard to get Mazda also in any list >___<" But Mazda could be pretty interesting to use~

 

[heuningby]

I often use Tetto. He is awesome.

When I play a slann I also like to run Kroak. He makes TG so much more viable and he is really cheap for what you get.

 

[KingCheops]

I play with them. Tetto and Gor Rok most but recently took Kroak out for a ride and find him very well balanced for his cost.

Hopefully Nakai makes an appearance for the End Times!

 

[Korhedron]

Very ambivalent. Tetto'eko is just a bit cheezy. Gor'rok is great fun, but I hesitate to use them. They cover some specific weaknesses, that I find is "a bit much". Like Throgg, I'm uncertain whether or not including one will remove the fun of a balanced game for my opponent. Then again, I hope to field a more well-rounded Kroc'gar/Grymlock one day... That metal hand/beam...

 

[Xuil]

This edition we finally came out on top when it comes to special characters! Not only are most of them usable (some at a push), but Tetto'Eko and Gor'Rok can completely change your army and open up new possibilities. A stubborn Saurus block and vanguarding monsters makes for a very different game.

We always allow special characters, but I am frequently the only one in my group who takes them. That said, I face a lot of gun lines and need Tetto.

 

[SilverFaith]

My local group has the opinion that disallowing SCs is the equivalent of disallowing specific units. The written "rules of play" we have says, and I quote (post translation):

"Special Characters are always allowed, as we do not believe censoring your army book or codex will lead to a more balanced game. To us, it is the equivalent of banning any other unit, like White Lions, Cannons, or Demon Princes. Keep this in mind before complaining about your opponents SCs!"

I sorta agree with them. Balance isn't perfect to begin with, but it would seem odd to ban a special character who, despite how powerful he might be, is still just 1 guy with a high price-tag, where, say, Banner of the World Dragon grants some obscene buffs to an entire unit of relatively cheap and brutally powerful models, including any characters.

Trying to balance the armies by disallowing SCs is a slippery slope.

I do enjoy making my own characters though, and being the writer I am, I like coming up with huge backstories, especially for the oldbloods. That said, I'm a bit annoyed by the fact that the special characters generally have abilities I'd really like on my custom characters, but can't.

Granting stubborn can be done though, which is why i've rarely considered using Gor'Rok. He's cool and all, but he is just too squishy, even with T6. His ability "Resillient" is also pretty meh on a 2 wound model. He is a cheap way to get stubborn though, a scarvet would cost 115 points base for the same ability, without T6 and any of his other nifty abilities.

 

[Sleboda]

Like SilverFaith said in a way, the OP's question might as well be "Cannons, yay or nay" or "Models with 2+ armor saves, yay or nay" or "skirmishing units, yay or nay" or ...

They are units in your book. Use them or don't as a personal choice, but telling others not to use them is silly.

 

[lordkingcrow]

Maybe I didn't clarify enough in my original post. We don't insist that nobody takes special characters. If a new person came into the fold that liked to use them, we don't tell them no or suggest they not. There are a couple that do, Grimgor comes to mind and has made quite the impact when used, and I see it as a challenge to take him down with self made characters. The guys I play with most often and I just feel the same way about using them. To say that they are like saying "no cannons" or "no 2+ armor saves" is a bit of a stretch, but I guess that's your view and your entitled to it. Looks like most of you use special characters, and that's great! Just curious to hear what is out there. Doesn't look like there are as many liked minded individuals as I thought there would be!

 

[SilverFaith]

To say that they are like saying "no cannons" or "no 2+ armor saves" is a bit of a stretch

Not really. It's limiting you official army book. Saying they "have a heavy impact on the balance of the game" isn't a valid reason, because I can name several things that does that aside from SCs. BotWD, all of the no-save spells, cannons, anything that ignores armour, anything that auto-wounds, etc. etc.

It's cool to encourage people to make their own characters, but SCs have an unfortunate amount of cool and useful special rules that would either be super useful in your army, or just fit the character you have in mind.

Remember that the SCs are merely statblocks and special rules with names attached. Just like how I can give my Oldblood Cowboy a Talisman of Preservation and call it "Sacred Spawning of Xholt", I can take Kroq'gars statline and call him something entirely different, with a different appearance and backstory, etc.

Just keep that in mind when someone brings a SC to the table

 

[lordkingcrow]

Point taken. Like I said, it's just a preference most have in my group, but no one is by any means forced to do it. The local hobby store here is starting an escalation league that does not allow SC. 500 point armies to begin with that gain 250 each month. The goal is to promote interest in the hobby as well as get us to know our armies better. I'm looking forward to it and, being a bit of an amateur writer myself, think there could be some fun background building to be had when the battles eventually get bigger.

 

[SilverFaith]

Hey, I know a lot of people ban SCs. My previous group did as well, and for 40k rather than fantasy, which is completely absurd.

I still find it stupid to ban SCs, but of course, most people "forge their narrative" in different ways, which screws over some people more than others, unfortunately. Just look at some of the comp systems people have. I'd take a SC ban any day if I could avoid things like the swedish comp system.

 

[LawGnome]

For the longest time I was in the "don't bring special characters" camp. However, I think this was because my first army was ogres. Their special characters kinda suck. I figured that everyone should just take regular characters, because then everyone is on roughly even footing.

I've definitely changed my mind. Considering how few special characters are really worth their cost (Oxylotl, for example), I'm definitely ok with people spending more points on an expensive character because they like what it does. Alarielle, for instance, is awesome. Put her with a bunch of White Lions, and you have a really nasty unit to chew through. Tetto is also great, and he makes your magic phases more consistent, at the expense of increasing your miscast chance.

The characters are in the book. They are part of your army. If you want to bring them, you absolutely should. Doing otherwise is like banning certain armor saves like others have said. It's kinda silly.

 

[Kblock]

The group I play in does not allow SCs. I am one of the newer members of the group so have not complained too much. The rational is that because we do have some newer players, we want to learn the tactics and rules of the game before bringing in SCs. Not sure if I agree with that, but I am still having fun with my own Lords and Heroes.

 

[Sleboda]

The rational is that because we do have some newer players, we want to learn the tactics and rules of the game before bringing in SCs.

=> That's a pretty poor rationale.

Do they ban Steam Tanks, Mutaliths, Tomb Kings characters, the Celestial Huricanum, Bastiladons with the snake generator, Hellcannons, Elf Phoenixes, Vampires with powers, Slann with powers, and the Skaven book as a whole as well? Because those are all things with extra and/or fiddly rules too. On the flip side, plenty of special characters have very simple rules that do not vary from the norm much at all.

It's just an excuse. Show them the light.