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8th Ed. Oldblood on Carnosaur

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Cold One

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Going up against Wood Elves tomorrow, and going to try out the Carnosaur at last. Been wanting to get one for a while, and having beaten my opponents recently using a Slann I fancy a change. Plus, I need something that can kill a Treemen. Or two.

Its a 3000 point game, and I'm planning on using this build for the Oldblood:

Dawn Stone,
The Other Trickster's Shard,
Fencer's Blades,
Glittering Scales.

My High Elf friend has been using Dawn Stone a lot recently, and it seems insanely good on high Armour Save characters - which Oldbloods of course fit the bill nicely. Insanely frustrating to opponents, too - which is also where the Other Trickster's Shard comes in, as Wood Elf armies have a plethora of Ward Saves.

Fencer's Blades + Glittering Scales means most stuff would hit him on 5s at best, if not 6s, and also gives him 6 attacks hitting on 3s.

My big concern is Killing Blow. My opponent loves Waywatchers and Wardancers. The former I think I can handle with terradons and skinks. Should my Oldblood run up against the latter, though, backed up by a Wardancer noble, I'm concerned that even with the to-hit penalty that without a Ward Save the Killing Blow dance could be his downfall. That's if they even meet in combat.

What are people's thoughts? Is this too much of a risk? Should I play it safe?

I have two alternative builds in mind. The first drops the Dawn Stone and Glittering Scales and pick up the Armour of Destiny for that 4+ Ward Save. He'd be easier to hit now, without a rerolled AS, but with a chance of surviving KB.

The second takes the Maiming Shield, Sword of the Hornet and Talisman of Endurance, giving him 6 attacks on ASF. But this makesh im much easier to hit with a reduced WS.
 
KB is something to worry about but even if your oldblood does go down with your hit penalties it seems like they should really be targeting the carno as although no KB hitting on 4's with re-rolls and then 6's is better than hoping for 6's then 6's to KB
 
for the final build, does that give you a reasonable chance of killing a WE character before he has a go at KBing you? doesnt help against waywatchers, but then, neither does any of the other builds.

maybe take the item from the LM book for a 2+ ward against first wound?
 
I ran him recently against O&G 2500p with Dawn Stone, armor of destiny, bane head and a gw... Can't tell you much since he died in his first round of combat against mr Giant, Thump with club double 6 :(.
 
walach said:
for the final build, does that give you a reasonable chance of killing a WE character before he has a go at KBing you? doesnt help against waywatchers, but then, neither does any of the other builds.
Click to expand...

Its pretty average to be honest. 6 attacks hitting first on 4s, wounding on 3s. No AS from the strength 5 and no ward save on forest spirits. Could probably kill heroes no problem, though lords are a little more tricky. I especially hate that Wood Elf item that give the character a 2+ ward when down to 1 wouind, and the Annoyance of Nettles.
 
Remember that a character does not gain the extra attack from swinging two weapons. It's a lesson I learned recently from this very board so you might wish to reconsider.

As for the KB, I'd just do your best to ignore those units. It'll be a bit tougher to evade thos Way Watchers but you can out pace the War Dancers and just shoot them up with Skinks.

If your looking for protection I'd go with AoD, Dawn stone for that very nice reroll 1+ AS and 4+ ward and then take SotH for those nice strikes first.
 
JohnMavrick said:
Remember that a character does not gain the extra attack from swinging two weapons. It's a lesson I learned recently from this very board so you might wish to reconsider.
Click to expand...

What? Why not?
 
Unfortunately no. It states in the BRB that duel weilding is for models on foot only.
 
I've just been looking this up. The rule on page 91 refers to two/additional hand weapons and that an additional hand weapon cannot be used by a mounted model. Whereas on page 501 the Fencer's Blades are said to be paired weapons. It doesn't say 'models on foot only' in the item description, nor does it exclude mounted characters in the Paired Weapons entry, either. It simply states that they gain the Extra Attack special rule in addition to other special effects.
 
Fencer's Blades, plural as in more than one. Paired, as in there are two of them. You are swinging with two swords (one in each hand) therefor it's a magical additional hand weapon. That's the logic I follow anyways.
 
its not forbidden. you can even use fencer's blade with a shield. it's up to you how much of an ass you want to be and argue RAW, but you can.

i'd never use fencer's blades + shield but i wouldn't mind using them while mounted, nor would i mind if an opponent did that. i can actually see a guy on a [mount] wielding two swords (wich also give WS 10 meaning that his skill with them signifficantly increases).
 
Bibamus said:
its not forbidden. you can even use fencer's blade with a shield. it's up to you how much of an ass you want to be and argue RAW, but you can.

i'd never use fencer's blades + shield but i wouldn't mind using them while mounted, nor would i mind if an opponent did that. i can actually see a guy on a [mount] wielding two swords (wich also give WS 10 meaning that his skill with them signifficantly increases).
Click to expand...

Really? Is name calling and cursing really nessisary? I was only giving my interpretation of the rules and I did not realize that doing so would give you authorization to start spouting your mouth.
 
that was some sort of misunderstanding, in the way that i did not say that in any way.

you were arguing the opposite, i said you could be doing the opposite of what you suggese (i.e. use them with a shield even) and be an ass. under no circumstance would i be calling you an ass by arguing RAI, it would make no sense.
 
I appologize for my miscommunication. I was under th wrong impression but I thank you for correcting things.
 
Im sorry, but I dont see how fencing blades could be used with a shield. The description lists them as 'paired weapons'. Now if a person wants to claim a bonus attack from this *and note, the BRB calls it two weapons/additional hand weapon* then I would say they cant claim the shield bonus- if they want to claim the shield bonus, then they must apply RAW and not gain the extra attack, because 'paired weapons' doesnt mean a darn thing.
 
I wouldn't allow the shield bonus either.

If the item description said "magical hand weapons" or the Paired Weapons entry said something like "for all intents and purposes they are magical hand weapons and follow the normal rules for fighting with two/additional hand weapon" then I would agree with you. But as it stands, they don't relate to one another as written.
 
Check the errata.

Reference Section – Magic Items, Paired Weapons
Change the last sentence to: “In addition to their other effects,
paired weapons have the Extra Attack and the Requires Two
Hands special rules.”

This has not been an issue for some time.
 
the only time you could use the shield whejn you have a 2 handed weapon is out side of combat,
like for +1 armor when geting shot at... well at least thats how it worked in 7th...
not sure is thats still the case in 8th... :shifty:
 
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