8th Ed. New lists for an upcoming tournament

[pgarfunkle]

I've signed up to a tournament run by a local club at the beginning of November and have been putting together lists to try out over the next few weeks.

There are 2 lists, one at 1,000pts and one at 2,400pts. Basically anything in the lower points has to be in the higher points list, I can add to existing units but cannot remove anything. The general can change between lists but the BSB cannot, this means no Slann BSB for me which is how I usually run.

My 1,000pts is as follows for now.

Lords
Saurus Old Blood - Armour of Destiny, Shield

Heroes
Saurus Scar Vet - BSB, Biting Blade, Enchanted Shield, Light Armour

Skink Priest - Dispel Scroll, Lvl 2 Upgrade

Core

Saurus Warriors - 20 Warriors, Spears, Full Command

Skink Skirmishers - 10 Skinks, Blowpipes.

Skink Skirmishers - 10 Skinks, Blowpipes

Rare

Salamander Hunting Pack - 2 Salamanders

Total Points 996.

I haven't decided on which lore to go with on the Priest as I think both Beasts and Heavens have something to offer. Mages cannot swap lore between games so once I decide that will have to be it so I am going to try and get in a few games with each to see which I think will benefit the list more.

I'm also going to try the skinks with javelins and shields to see which function better, so far I have only played with the blowpipes.

Another option is to swap out the Salamanders for a Bastiladon which I will be picking up this weekend. I do love me some Sallies though so it a difficult decision.

I'll be putting up my first thoughts for a 2,400pts list later and as I have a lot of painting to do over the next few weeks I'm going to start a log to help keep me on track.

Anyway I'd appreciate peoples thoughts on the first list, have I left any glaring weaknesses or what do you think of my options?

Cheers

Richard

 

[A Steaming Kroak]

I think that I would consider dropping one or both of the Salamanders in a 1000pts list. They really only perform well against large blocks, and you probably won' t be seeing large infantry at this point level. I would also try to get your Old Blood Mounted on a cold one, and give him a great weapon. He will be very difficult for your opponent to deal with in a 1000pts game.

As for the rest of your list, I would personally focus on more movement in a smaller point level game. Because of the fewer units on the table, there is lots of extra room during the move phase. Try to take advantage of this. Cor or maybe a stegadon could work. Perhaps drop the saurus for more skinks.

Lets see your 2400 list.

 

[pgarfunkle]

OK 2,400 pts list is as follows so far.

Lords
Saurus Old Blood - Armour of Destiny, Shield

Slann Mage-Priest - Channelling Staff, Focus of Mystery, Harmonic Convergence, Reservoir of Eldritch Energy

Heroes
Saurus Scar Vet - BSB, Biting Blade, Enchanted Shield, Light Armour

Skink Priest - Dispel Scroll, Lvl 2 Upgrade

Core

Saurus Warriors - 20 Warriors, Spears, Full Command

Saurus Warriors - 19 Warriors, HW & Shields, Full Command

Skink Skirmishers - 10 Skinks, Blowpipes.

Skink Skirmishers - 10 Skinks, Blowpipes

Special

Bastiladon - Solar Engine

Temple Guard - 20 Guard, Full Command

Rare

Salamander Hunting Pack - 2 Salamanders

Ancient Steg - Engine of the Gods, Sharpened Horns

Total Points 2,395pts

Hi Kroak,

Yeah I have thought about putting in Cold ones but I've not really had much experience of using them and so I'm not sure how effective they would be in a larger game.

I was trying to work out how I could add a cold one but just realised i could drop the shield and a couple of saurus in the lower list and in the larger list I could drop reservoir on the slann. This may require me to buy a new mini or perhaps I can green stuff some armour onto one of my existing cold ones. I will have to give this a try in an upcoming practice game.

 

[Mr Phat]

I think that I would consider dropping one or both of the Salamanders in a 1000pts list. They really only perform well against large blocks, and you probably won' t be seeing large infantry at this point level.

I agree with this..
but if you do want the range: remember that Razordons dont care about unit size + they are cheaper so they will leave you extra points.

 

[Mr Phat]

To the bottom list:

20 TG isnt enough to do anything in this size.

anything below 24 is better in Saurus by the point to my experience.

Yeah I have thought about putting in Cold ones but I've not really had much experience of using them and so I'm not sure how effective they would be in a larger game.

of all the units in our army Cold ones is the unit that I have never felt let down by.

I usually run them like this

6 + Champion (7 in all)
6 Wide

added a Scar-vet: Cold One, glittering scales, sword of striking, shield.

put em on the flank and let them meet whatever infantry or standard cav...they WILL win.

Whatever you ram will have to choose if they want to go at the not too big unit or take out your scar.
If they go for the unit, they usually hit a max or 3 (my experience)
leaving 4 boys with a healthy scar-vet.

if they go for the vet..well.. ´-1 to hit +1 AS ...he rarely dies....and the whole unit strikes back.

I love these guys. No good without the cowboy though

oh...and put the Saurus blocks together into one. they work way better in numbers, as they usually win by grinding.

..and dont drop resovoir

 

[A Steaming Kroak]

I think the saurus units and Temple guard are all too small in the 2400pts list. I also think that the two saurus characters on foot are expensive, and really not worth the points in their current setup. You would be better running both as cowboys on Cold one, IMO. As foot models, they are setup to only bring str5 and are not very maneuverable.

Is the 1000pts a separate competition within the tournament? or is it a team competition? This is important for understanding your list. If it is a separate competition - not team, then you should consider fielding 4 x 10 skink skirmishers as core. Then add in a couple of hitters like cowboys, a steg, CoR, or even your Bastilidon. This setup will allow you to outmaneuver your opponent, and pick the spots where you want to fight.

At 2400, I would drop one of the units of saurus and use one larger unit - 25 or 30. The other points would go into adding the extra skinks from your 1000pts list, and use the rest to beef your TG. If the 1000pts games are weighted similarly to the 2400 games, then I would focus on building a fast list to try and win these games. Lizardmen actually have a huge speed advantage at this point level, and I feel that you could easily take these games using this advantage (provided you don't put a slow block of saurus on the table).

 

[pgarfunkle]

Basically I have 2 games at 1,000pts and then another 2 games at 2,400pts. Anything that is is the 1,000pts list has to be in the 2,400pts list.

Basically between the two lists I can add but not remove. Any equipment a unit has in the 1st list it also has to have in the second list, for instance I can increase a units size but not change the weapons they are armed with. Also a wizard cannot change lore or levels between games and my BSB in the first list has to be the BSB in the second list although the general can change.

 

[A Steaming Kroak]

If that is the case then I would probably leave the saurus out at 1000pts. Focus on outmaneuvering your opponent. Bring the saurus back in at 2400pts, and then you have the option to grind up the middle. 1000pts is such a different game than 2400. You should design your list to win those 2 games, and then bring the other 1400pts in to flesh out the style of 2400 list that you want. The first 1000 list you put together seems like you are just pulling things out of your 2400 list and trying to make it work. Try and build the 1000 list to win those two games, and then fit those units into the 2400. This should actually be easier, because everything in a 1000pts list should still be good in the expanded list.

Like I said in the previous post, 4x10 skinks would be ideal for 1000pts core. Then add a block of 30 saurus to bring the core up to 2400pts. Use the skinks to distract and evade the opponent, and hit him in a couple of spots with your hammers (cowboys, stegs, CoR, etc.) Pick your fight, only engage where you know you will win. Saurus warriors don't have this choice; they fight whatever is in front of them after the deployment stage (unless you chaff the opponent). At 1000, they will basically either win or lose based on what the opponent puts across from them. You don't get much flexibility to dictate the game with them in. At 2400, the strategy changes. You have more access to buff the saurus or use chaff to find a favourable matchup for them.

 

[pgarfunkle]

Hi Kroak,

Yeah that's pretty much what I was doing while working with the models I currently have. I'm a bit more used to playing at the higher limit so I was trying to work out what I could take from my usual list to put into the smaller army while making required changes such as the BSB separate from the Slann.

I've got a game night tomorrow and hoping we may be able to squeeze in 2 games at the 1,000pts limit so will try the list with the Bastiladon in place of the Salamanders and another list without the Saurus and replace them with COC with the Old Blood and Scar Vet on Cold Ones. If go for that I will need to dig through the bits box and for some green stuff to stick some armour on one of my Cold One champs.

Then I will need to get some serious painting on!

Any thoughts before the warm ups tomorrow would be appreciated and I will let you know how the lists played out.

 

[A Steaming Kroak]

Have fun! Maybe post the list you decide on using for the tournament after your practice games.

 

[Rhodium]

my BSB in the first list has to be the BSB in the second list although the general can change.

Ooft that's a kick in the gut for lizards,

 

[pgarfunkle]

So I had that practice game the other week and the Saurus unit with the two heroes performed strongly, but unfortunately not enough to give me the game.

The Bastiladon managed to hold up a hydra in combat for a couple of turns thanks to its high save but unfortunately on the only turn I managed to get the bound spell off it whiffed (a regular occurrence when I use random effects but I just can't help myself). This didn't upset me too much however as the reason it only went off once was I was using it to draw out my opponents dispel dice before casting with the wizard.

My main lesson from this game was that this list is not fast enough to recover from a poor deployment. We rolled the random deployment (dawn attack I think) and I was spread all over the place with the Saurus in the centre, a skink unit with the priest on the left and the other skink unit on the right. Unfortunately for me my opponent managed to roll his entire army on my right so I spend a good portion of the game slogging across the field getting shot by cross bows.

I'm hoping to get in a game next week with the 2nd list which should be a lot more mobile.

So far my painting progress over the last couple of weeks for the tournament has not been good but I have a free Sunday this weekend so hopefully something will get done!