8th Ed. Need advice on list building

[Kinslayer]

Hi guys, it has been a little while since I played warhammer at all but I used to play Lizardmen in 6th as well as other armies. I have played 8th edition but only using Vampire Counts, before their 8th edition book. Now I am looking to start over and collect fantasy again with the Lizardmen. I've already ordered the bulk of an army but I am having some trouble putting those models into a decent list. I've also struggled to keep to the points limit when including everything I want to use, despite the fact I've read all the tacticas and advice given on this forum to help me come up with a list.

I'd like to stay away from metal models / models that will likely be redone with the eventual 8th edition upgrade. This is why I did not yet include a Slann although I suppose it will be resin cast sooner or later. I also really like the carnosaur and it is something I never played in 6th edition, so I wanted to give that a go. The first list I drew up was way over my points limit, so I had to drop out the cavalry all together and some of the skinks. The trouble I am having is this has left me with a list that looks nothing like the saurus heavy army I had imagined, so maybe that list is just not possible?

Also this does not have to be 2000 points, I will have enough models to play 2500 or even 3000. My opponents will vary but the main two are likely skaven and bretonnia.



I bought two battalions, a carnosaur, a stegadon & a plastic oldblood. This will give me the following;
40 saurus
20 temple guard
16 cold one cavalry
24 skinks
1 stegadon
1 skink priest
1 scar veteran
1 oldblood on carnosaur

I was going to buy the third battalion as you're essentially getting the cavalry free, but I can't even fit the 16 into my army now let alone 24. I will probably just bulk out the core with two more skink boxes (and use some to make chameleons too)



What I did want to include in an army list... carnosaur, saurus, saurus cavalry, stegadon and some magic defence.
What I think I would also like in there... kroxigor, probably in skinks, and chameleons & salamanders because they seem almost essential.
What I am not interested in using... terradons, swarms, razodons, engine of the gods, loads of skinks, or at this point a Slann.

Temple guard are really awesome, but are they worth it without the Slann? If not and I want to include them I might make it a duel Carnosaur/Slann list and take it to 3000 points.



How I invisioned the army to look based on the box sets I ordered was two units of 8 cold ones going down one flank with the carnosaur, while the stegadon and the kroxigor in skinks goes down the other to split attention. The saurus block move up and hold the centre as an anvil while the units that moved up get in the flanks of any chargers. Meanwhile some small skink units harass enemy flankers and threaten positioning, while some chameleons deal with any war machines from behind enemy lines. Making a good list around those models is what I need help with though, if the idea is even going to work? Or are saurus cavalry just too over priced?



Here are two of the character builds I was mulling over last night. Any good? I'm not a huge fan of over doing it on the characters I'd rather leave points for more units than wargear.

Saurus Oldblood – 245
Sword of Bloodshed, Carnosaur Pendant, Gamblers Armour
Carnosaur – 210

Scar Veteran – 119
Great Weapon, Light Armour, Shield, Potion of Strength




Thanks in advance for any help.

 

[Eladimir]

I'll start at the bottom, I wouldn't take a potion of str on a GW SV since S7 is pretty damn good already.
Swap it out for the Frog Poison, only 10 pts and makes his attack poisoned and magical. Also no need to buy the shield since hes got a GW.

Old Blood - might as well give him a shield.


I personally really don't think TG are worth it without the Slann so don't worry about them for now if you don't have a slann.
You'll want two skinks priests probably pick up the slack for not having a slann though (1 is okay if thats what you have)

What you really need to get now are some Salamanders, great vs hordes (skaven) and armor (Brets)
If if you need to proxy some in with a cold one and some skinks I'd give them a try. They are lovely.

 

[Qupakoco]

Copy+Paste Eladimir's comments.

How I invisioned the army to look based on the box sets I ordered was two units of 8 cold ones going down one flank with the carnosaur, while the stegadon and the kroxigor in skinks goes down the other to split attention. The saurus block move up and hold the centre as an anvil while the units that moved up get in the flanks of any chargers. Meanwhile some small skink units harass enemy flankers and threaten positioning, while some chameleons deal with any war machines from behind enemy lines. Making a good list around those models is what I need help with though, if the idea is even going to work? Or are saurus cavalry just too over priced?

Saurus Cavalry are indeed overpriced, but they can still be useful. Just keep them on the flank and away from a grind-fest. Stupidity will happen once a game on average, so be prepared for that. If you are going to run those Saurus in one block, I recommend that to keep them with lots of ranks as to retain steadfast. Otherwise an Old Blood/Scar-Vet with Crown of Command in their midst will be essential for their role as holding the center. A Scar-Vet BSB kept close by them will be awesome as well.

You may want to think about using the TG kit to beef up a couple of your Cavalry guys. Scar-Vet Cowboys are awesome, and two of them can be just as effective as an entire unit of Cold One Cavalry.

 

[Kinslayer]

Thanks for the replies. One quick question is the Carnosaur pendant worth it because the Carnosaur already has the same special rule, does it just give the rider +1 attack?

If so I think that build will dish out a lot of hurt, I will definately add the shield. If I run that Lord with the two units of 8 cavalry I am already using a lot of points. Then I add the stegadon and saurus block, so what else should I include? I'd like a skink and kroxigor block but I don't think the point are there after skirmishers, and if I dont use one is one block of saurus going to be enough? Obviously I will then add the skink skirmishers, chameleons, salamanders, skink priests for defence.

Also I want to keep the Temple Guard models as they are as I will eventually use them in larger games.

I think I will aim for 2500 points for now so I can fit it all in... would a Slann & Carnosaur be too much at this size?

 

[Qupakoco]

Thanks for the replies. One quick question is the Carnosaur pendant worth it because the Carnosaur already has the same special rule, does it just give the rider +1 attack?

Yep, and if the Carno dies he will still be subject to Frenzy.

If you only have one block you need to make sure you play the re-directing game at it's finest. Lost of skinks will help with that. Heck, some people run an all skirmisher list at 2,400 and are very successful.

I think I will aim for 2500 points for now so I can fit it all in... would a Slann & Carnosaur be too much at this size?

Eh, yah. I think a naked Oldblood+Carno and a Slann puts you at 630 points, which is more than the 25% allowance of 625. I'd pick one or the other so you can give them some gear.

 

[Devean]

Old Blood - might as well give him a shield.

Actually I wouldn't give him a shield. Isn't he at a 1+AS already? 4+ Scaly Skin, +2 AS heavy armour (gamblers) and +1 AS for being ridden?

 

[Smexygor]

Thick skinned. +2 while riding a cold one. So he's 2+ just base.

 

[Arli]

He would be 1+ for strength modifiers. A roll of 1 always fails, but when figuring the modifiers in combat, you would start at 1+.