7th Ed. Lizzy Newbie - 1250 points

[Bakatron]

Hiya folks, first post!

Ok, I've recently got back into Warhammer, and I've been picking up Lizzies. On Sunday I'll be having my first game, at 1250 points (cause that's all the beastmen my friend has!). I could probably make 2k if I used my Temple Guard and Carnosaur, but that's another point! Here's my first list, feel free to hack it apart. Bear in mind I'm working with models available - I have the batallion, a stegadon, the carnosaur and a salamander so far.


Lizardmen - 1250 points.

Heroes:

Skink Priest lvl2 - 440 Points
- Ancient Stegadon w/ Engine of the Gods
- Diadem of Power
- Dispel Scroll

Scar-Veteran - 125 Points
- Light Armour
- Enchanted Shield
- Burning Blade of Chotec

(Sits in the unit of Saurus)

Core:

19x Saurus Warriors - 246 Points
- Spears
- Musician
- Standard Bearer

12x Skink Skirmishers - 84 Points

Special:

8x Cold One Cavalry - 280 Points

Rare:

1x Salamander - 75 Points


As I see it, this gives me a big anvil unit with a tasty leader in it, a skink wall, some fast flankers and the closest we get to artillery, all topped up with the Steggy's EotG and a wizard. What do you think?

 

[Strim]

Why you want 8 cold ones for? If it's in one row they'll be very hard to move, if they are in 2 rows the second one will not be used and therefore it's a waste of points... The maximum i would recommend in cavalry units is 6, for even against a small unit of small miniatures in rows of 5, all the six of them get to fight (or 5 + hero).

Too many points in that skink priest for a 1250 points army... With those points you get a level 1 skink priest with diadem and scroll (115 points and only 1 less dispell dice than before) and another scar veteran on cold one to get on the cavalry unit.

Then, 19 saurus are too many for a 1250 points army... with 15 you should be ok, and with the points saved for that and 2 skirmishers of the other basic unit, you should be able to get another small unit of skink skirmishers.

Find the points (maybe from the EotG or the, in my opinion, 3 unnecessary cold ones) to get a unit of terradon riders. No lizardmen army ahould go to war without a minimum of 1 nuit of terradon riders.

Good luck!

 

[Bakatron]

I agree with most of what you've said there, to be honest - howevr the issue, as I stated, however, is figures. I don't have my terradons or extra skinks yet

I've taken what I have there mostly cause it's what I have access to...


Edit: Ok, I did a quick order. Sod it, I'm gonna buy 'em some time, why not now?

How's this?

Lizardmen - 1250 points.

Heroes:

Skink Priest lvl2 - 440 Points
- Ancient Stegadon w/ Engine of the Gods
- Diadem of Power
- Dispel Scroll

Scar-Veteran - 125 Points
- Light Armour
- Enchanted Shield
- Burning Blade of Chotec

(Sits in the unit of Saurus)

Core:

14x Saurus Warriors - 186 Points
- Spears
- Musician
- Standard Bearer

11x Skink Skirmishers - 77 Points

11x Skink Skirmishers - 77 Points

Special:

5x Cold One Cavalry - 175 Points

3x Terradon Riders - 90 Points

Rare:

1x Salamander - 80 Points
- Extra Skink Handler

I'm pretty set on keeping the EotG. It's going to be a staple of my army as I make it bigger, and it's one of the few models I actually have painted already!

 

[Strim]

I like it a lot more now (although i think the EotG is quite expensive for that army, a third of your total army cost is too much, but if you're ok with it, fine )

And another thing, as i can see you are starting this army, so if you play against your friends, i would ask them to play Paperhammer (i get that you know what this is) before buying things that you don't know if you are going to use (i've done this myself when i started and my friends were ok with it)

P.S.: You should introduce yourself in a proper way here: http://www.lustria-online.com/viewforum.php?f=18

 

[Bakatron]

Gotta admit I'm liking this army more too.

As far as paperhammer, I presume you mean using substitute models etc? I'm not actually a fan of that. I'm quite happy to buy figures even if I don't use them too often, as it's more options and more fun things to paint

Oh, and I've done some snooping. My opponent is playing Beasts of Chaos with remarkably little ranged or artillery. I think my Steggy will be fine and dandy

 

[Dumbledore]

If it's a beastmen horde you may want to deploy and advance all along one flank so that it is harder for him to swamp you

 

[Bakatron]

Interesting, I'll bear that in mind, thanks

 

[snowywlf]

I think you have a pretty solid list there. It's flexible enough to flow with the punches but it also has survivability and bite. Very balanced overall.

 

[Barotok]

Looking good for a starting list to me as well. You'll be pretty strong in the magic phase but I think the thing that will be a clincher for you, is how the stegadon is handled. I know that you're set on keeping EotG in the list which is fine, just know that you'll probably spend a bit of time trying to protect it from shooting (unless you only play against beasts). Because it occupies such a large percentage of your list (in terms of points), enemies will have a good chance at a victory if they can take down your steg.

I wanted to make a comment on the Cold One Riders as well. Running them 6 wide is definitely the way to go like Strim said. However, bringing a larger unit can do a couple of things. Firstly, running with a few extra riders at the back, helps cusion shooting casualties and allows the riders not to get slowed up behind a screen before charging. Also, the option is there to really beef the unit out, giving it full command along with a magic standard (Huanchi's perhaps?) giving you the option of just charging something outright. Very few units can manage to hold up against such a charge, unless of course the dice gods are meddling (like they usually do). For this points value, I would also drop the unit down to 5 riders as you're sinking a lot of points into your engine as it is now.

Best of luck in your beastmen hunting.

 

[Bakatron]

Thanks all!

Game is tonight, so i'll let you know how I'm doing. I'm gonna have to proxy some figures unfortunately, as my terradons and second unit of skinks didn't arrive yesterday, despite me paying for express delivery... someone's mail order company is getting a stinky email about that!

 

[Bakatron]

Victory! Mwahaha! Or something.

The force I was up against was a big pile o' beastmen. Big unit of Bestigors, big Gor/Un-gor beast herd, two chariots, trolls and minotaurs and a Bray-shaman. Game started shakily when my Cavalry got chariotted in the face (d6+1 hits = 7 :/), 3/5 of them died straight away. Luckily, steggies are also awesome at charges and wiped out the chariot completely, then overran straight into the Herd and chased them off the board. My Comet of whatever it's called was... interesting. Took 3 turns to show up, then obliterated a chariot, half the Herd, the Shaman and his Trolls... and a unit of skinks, half my Saurus and wounded my priest... still, I think I came off best. First attack from the Salamander misfired, but from then on he was well behaved (I figured he was full!). Steggy, remaining COC and the Saurus marched across the board. I screwed up a bit with the Terradons, I'll have a better idea of what to do in future.

On the right flank, his Bestigors and the 5 minotaurs caused me some trouble. I ended up with 3 minotaurs against the Scar-vet (the rest of the Saurus died due to low initiative) and one remaining Cold One... luckily, Scar-vets rule and I won. Timely flanking charges from the Salamander (nothing much else to do with him) and the Steggy on turn 6 routed the bestigors and I ran his army down to a man.

On hindsight, I think everything worked well. I'd probably change my magic items on the priest, and maybe drop him to level 1 and work in a second priest for more magic fun in future, as I was wasting a bunch of dice. I think Diadem is probably a better choice in a bigger game , I might have been better off with the magic staff with a bound spell in it.

Couple o' quick things. Stand and shoot with skinks, do they still get multiple shots? And for that matter , could a Salamander stand and shoot? Secondly, spellcasters can still cast in combat, right? We presumed so, but weren't 100% sure.

But yay! Success! And now to upload some photos of my guys

 

[Barotok]

Congrats on your first victory, sounds like you had an eventfull game! I'd like to take a moment to answer the questions that you had at the end of your post. Here goes.

Stand and shoot with skinks, do they still get multiple shots?

Yes. You may choose to fire multiple shots but remember, firing multiple shots is an additional -1 to hit.

I find that typically my skinks don't fire doubles when being charged, unless they're being charged from what I like to call a 'sweet spot'. If you are being charged from within 6" of the enemy (meaning your blowpipes are at short range), I have a tendancy to fire doubles. Typically though, an enemy that is within 6" of you that charges disallows your ability to stand and shoot (They are within 1/2 of their charge range and your troops have no time to react by shooting). If an enemy is charging you from long range (on the blowpipes) and you decide to fire doubles it ends up being 7s to hit because of the following modifiers.
4+ to hit (BS3)
+1 Charging enemy = 5+
+1 Long Range = 6+
+1 Multilple shots = 7+

You can find more details on the Stand & Shoot rules on pg19 of your BRB.

could a Salamander stand and shoot?

A quick look at the salamander rules in the LM Army book answers this question easily. Slamanders may not make a Stand & Shoot charge reaction ever, according to the LM Army Book (pg56).

Secondly, spellcasters can still cast in combat, right?

The short answer is, Yes!

The long answer is, Maybe! The reason is that it depends on the spell you are casting and the situation. Some spells called magic missiles may not be cast at units that are in close combat (including the unit the wizard is fighting). Other spells, require you to have a line of sight to your target. If you are in close combat the only target you have a line of sight to is the unit you are fighting. Still other spells, only affect the caster or have no line of sight restrictions. Of course, these spells are able to be cast in close combat. Still other spells say specifically in their description that they may be cast on units in close combat, which makes them an exception to an exception. For more details, check out the magic section of the master rules, starting on pg. 104. An exception to all of this is the Slann Mage priest. As long as the Slann is in the unit of Temple Guard, he may cast spells like normal, just as if he was not in combat (provided he is in the 2nd rank still). This bonus is because of the Slann's Palanquin that he rides on which rises above the fighting to release a spell, only to slip back down into the protection of his unit.

As an example for different rules for magic, lets say we have a wizard whos unit has just been charged. Our wizard knows all the spells from the Lore of Beasts (pg. 115 BRB). The first spell, The Bear's Anger, may be cast by our wizard even though he is in close combat because the spells description says "even if engaged in close combat." However, the fifth spell in the lore, The Hunter's Spear, may not be cast because the only unit that wizard has line of sight to is in close combat (with his own unit, of course). As a last example, lets take a look at the forth spell in the lore, The Beast Cowers. This spell can be cast on any "enemy cavalry unit, swarm, chariot, or a single ridden or unridden monster anywhere on the battlefield, even if the target is engaged in combat. Even though our wizard can not see the unit it is casting on, the spell text does not specifically say that it requires line of sight. Therefore he may cast it.



Hope that answers your questions and congratulations on your victory once again!

*Edit* -1 to hit for firing doubles, not +1. My language seems backwards from the general consensus on this board as far as the logic used for working out modifiers. Most likely just the screwed up way that I think of it.

 

[Revered_Guardian]

but remember, firing multiple shots is an additional +1 to hit.

-1 to hit barotok! -1!

we dont want the new guy thinking the more shots he makes the more accurate they are!

but ya, skink blowpipes are like machineguns

 

[snowywlf]

First attack from the Salamander misfired, but from then on he was well behaved (I figured he was full!).

Love it!

I also love the Comet of Cassandra. Even if it wipes out half of my army and half of the enemies army, it is a great sight to behold.

Kudos on your win!

 

[Bakatron]

Thankee

Yeah, the comet was fun. Wiped out most of the middle of the battlefield!

And yay, my Terradons arrived