8th Ed. How did Skink/Kroxigor Units get worse?

[Jabroniville]

Question: How did Skink/Kroxigor units get worse in this edition, exactly? I keep hearing about it, but reading the rules, I can't find the issue.

In the old rules: Kroxigor were in the second rank, but could reach over the Skinks to attack (ie. Supporting Attacks). The enemy model in base contact with a Skink can be attacked, as well as being able to attack that Kroxigor- the rules clearly state this under "Great Reach".

In the new rules: Kroxigor GAIN in power (Strength 5), gain Predatory Fighter (which can SOMETIMES work against them), and then DROP in points. Enemies can still contact a Kroxigor in base contact with a Skink that enemy is touching. Only Skinks can be hurt by Stomps & Thunderstomps.

So what's different? Are people mis-reading the old rule, or am I missing something?

 

[hdctambien]

Due to a quirk of the 7th - 8th BRB transition the Skrox unit was a Unique Unit and Unique Units cannot be Stomped. Also, with the 7th edition LM the Kroxigor could not be targeted over the skinks.

That made a Skrox unit perfect for going after Monsters, MI, and anything that had a high enough strength to kill Saurus just as easily as they would kill Skinks (if they are wounding on a 2+ vs Saurus and giving them no armor save, then why not feed them 5 point models instead of 11 point models)

Now Kroxigor can be targeted (which is how it was in the 7th Ed BRB rules) and the skinks can be stomped (which should have always been the rule)

The Skrox unit was accidentally powerful and the new book just fixed the loopholes.

 

[hdctambien]

the Kroxigor could not be targeted over the skinks.

I"m unable to find my printout of the old LM FAQ, but I'm pretty sure there was a line in there that negated the entirety of the Great Reach rule due to the fact that all models in the 2nd rank can attack in the 8th BRB rules. However, by negating that rule, the "enemies can attack the kroxigor" stipulation was FAQed out of existence.


The long and the short of it is, Skrox units are back to exactly how they were in 7th Edition BRB ecosystem and the 6th Ed LM book (Krox str 5 and skink Ld 5) Except now the skinks can get Poison Attacks, so they are technically better!

 

[Jabroniville]

So it was only a weird FAQ that got rid of the "Great Reach" rule? That's weird- what did the FAQ say about it?

 

[Scalenex]

What everyone else said, plus it's iffy whether PF applies to supporting attacks until the new FAQ comes out.

We are creatures of habit. Skroxigor use to be great at killing monsters and cavalry, but now the very things you used to take Skroxigor for are EXTRA good at fighting Skroxigor. A monster or unit of knights can target the Kroxigor and kill most of them before the Kroxigor strike.

 

[GCPD]

In addition to what's been said, once you eliminate teh targets Skink-Kroxigor used to have (Monsters, MI, Cav, etc), there's not all that much that they are actually good at.

 

[hdctambien]

So it was only a weird FAQ that got rid of the "Great Reach" rule? That's weird- what did the FAQ say about it?

I believe the FAQ was something along the lines of "Ignore the Great Reach rule"

They did this because in 8th Edition anything can attack from the 2nd rank, so the Great Reach rule became redundant... except for the "Enemies can attack Krox in teh 2nd rank" part, which should have been FAQed back in, but never was.

 

[n810]

Well if you want to get technical, it was an Erata,
like he said it just stated ignore the Great Reach rule.

 

[VampTeddy]

the Kroxigor could not be targeted over the skinks.

I"m unable to find my printout of the old LM FAQ, but I'm pretty sure there was a line in there that negated the entirety of the Great Reach rule due to the fact that all models in the 2nd rank can attack in the 8th BRB rules. However, by negating that rule, the "enemies can attack the kroxigor" stipulation was FAQed out of existence.


The long and the short of it is, Skrox units are back to exactly how they were in 7th Edition BRB ecosystem and the 6th Ed LM book (Krox str 5 and skink Ld 5) Except now the skinks can get Poison Attacks, so they are technically better!

http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1610148a_FAQ_Lizardmen_V1_4.pdf

Here ya go, it's still a link in the discussion subforum

 

[hdctambien]

Here ya go, it's still a link in the discussion subforum

Thanks VampTeddy!

For readers from the future when that PDF might no longer exist this is the old FAQ ruling that made Skrox units extra powerful:

Page 53, 97 – Kroxigors, Great Reach
Ignore this special rule.

 

[rantapanda]

What everyone else said, plus it's iffy whether PF applies to supporting attacks until the new FAQ comes out.

We are creatures of habit. Skroxigor use to be great at killing monsters and cavalry, but now the very things you used to take Skroxigor for are EXTRA good at fighting Skroxigor. A monster or unit of knights can target the Kroxigor and kill most of them before the Kroxigor strike.

i do think that a group of krox is a solid choice still versus most monsters. krox ans skrox are quite unique.... they have theyr uses, but those are very limited.

 

[Jabroniville]

OK cool, thanks!

From the complaining I was hearing about the Skroxigor units ("they're ruined FOREVER and no one will EVER take them again!"), I thought something was up. They still seem pretty good at fighting off cavalry, just in a slightly different way- the unit can still have ranks, giving us one of the few Monstrous Infantry units in the game that can maintain a rank bonus. I always felt the unit was vulnerable however, since they Skinks are such easy CR to grab (they're the worst fighters EVER).

 

[- Q -]

plus it's iffy whether PF applies to supporting attacks until the new FAQ comes out.

Any day now...

 

[NIGHTBRINGER]

Any day now...