8th Ed. a 1500pt heavy saurus list, needs a lot of help.

[Raithial]

Hi.
I'm quite new on this forum; in fact, this is my first post, so I'm bound to look like I don't understand quat about the game... but hey.

As for the topic: I'd like some advice or help, building up an army-list for regular 1000pt to 1500pt games.
One needn't worry about my collection of models, because I can fairly much cough up any model within the range at least 3 or four times in neccecary.
What I'm having trouble with is that in each battle no single skink is left alive, Kroxigors are dying beyond the regular casualties and the only truly reliable troops are any Saurus Warrior Variant (including Temple-guards, Cavallery and the likes).
So basically,I'd like help getting the ideal Saurus heavy list.

The list I had thought up is quite badly put together, with no magic items or stuff..

18 Saurus Warriors, Spears and shields, Full command
12 Saurus Warriors, Spears and shields, Full Command
12 Saurus Warriors, Swords and shields, Full command
10 temple-guards, Halberds and shields, Full command
10 Saurus Cavallery, Swords and Shields, full Command
20 Skinks, Blowpipes javelins and shields+2 kroxigors
20 Skinks, blowpipes Javelins and Shields
Chakax, The Eternity Warden

yeah, I know this army lacks heavily on magic and on ranged support, but I wanted a reliable close-combat army... as the list stands it's 1437 points. I was hoping people here might be able to help me build a far better list than this heap of units thrown into a blender xD

My gratitude beforehand.

 

[rammramm]

First of all, your units are too small. A Saurus unit should never be smaller than 20 models. This is because the more ranks the more reliable to stay in close combat and also because it takes longer for you to lose attacks.

Non-skirmishing skinks are rubbish without kroxigors. Skink units should be used as harassers or marchblockers unless they contain kroxigors which means they need to be small. 10 man strong units of skink skirmishers (would sugest 2 of those units) is probably the way to go.

Chakax is also extremely overpriced. If you play him because you think he is good for his points then you should change general, if you play him because you love the fluff/model then keep him.

Basicly an optimal 1500 point army would usually contain a slann with bsb and as many diciplines allowed (with either life or light), two 20 strong units of saurus without champions, a 20 strong unit with TG with FC and the rest filled upp with skink slirmishers, salamanders (who are probably the best unit we have), teradons or chameleon skinks.

Good luck.

Gustaf

 

[Raithial]

thanks. your advice was of great help. I'll see what it does this evening, when I have a game.
Also, my cavallery is sufficient? I mean, 10 Saurus Cavallery units with handweapons and shield with full command?
I'll have to buy a number of Temple-guards to meet up to the 20 of them. (I lost five because of an accident where my brother dropped them into a paint-bucket while he was painting his room... )

so, if I'm correct you're advising at least 20 saurus per block, and skirmish-groups of 10 skinks and maybe a larger skinkgroup with kroxes?
and yeah, I like the chakax fluff and model, and since I'm not doing any competitions...

So, a list consisting of
10 Skink Skirmishers with blowpipes and shields
10 Skink Skirmishers with Javelings and shields
20 Skinks with javelins and shield + 2 Krixigors
20 Saurus Warriors with Spears and shields X2
10 Temple Guards
10 Saurus Cavallery with handweapons and shields
1 Salamander + 3 Skink handlers
1 Chakax/Gor-rok/Slann/Tehenauin

Is that a better list?
I know it's still very skink-heavy but with my current lack of Saurus warriors (half are still packed because of moving to a new home. but Generally, is it any better?

 

[rammramm]

If you dont play a slann you shouldnt bother with the TG. They are too expensive. The CoC can be good in certain situations but are generally vieved as overpriced. I would not play 10 in a unit since that is oo much of a pointsink. If you want that much cavalry I would advice you to play 2 units of 5.

 

[Raithial]

hmm, sounds very appealing, what you're saying, I'll take it to heart this evening, I'll just roll with it and see what it ends up like. though I must admit, it's a slightly unfamiliar sight to my Lizardmen to put them in ranks like that, though I can see the tactical advantages. ^_^

And many thanks for you help 8D I'll report later this evening or maybe tomorrow to report on the battle, and see any further adjustments that might be needed.

 

[Raithial]

The battle last night was a great succes, though I couldn't finish the battle my troops took far less losses at the first 3 turns untill my saurus charged into close-combat. Chakax did come out a a lot to overpriced for his use, though I did manage to whack out a Dark Elf Dreadlord and eventually I managed to dish out 4 wounds on an Ogre Tyrant to boot (Prince Althran took his last 2 wounds out and claimed the kill).
The battle of 3000 points per side (Lizardmen & High elves VS Ogres and Dark Elves) so a combination between Chakax and Prince Althran was a glorious cooperation. The Scraplauncher almost blasted Chakax but thank god for that reroll on the Look-out-sir!
The High Elves generally only faught the Ogres, though in the end a few things started mixing up, like Althran charging the Ogre-tyrant after Chakax died. and my Skink Skirmishers continually harassing enemy flanks. Enemy got so pissed he wasted 2 turns shooting at those skinks, giving my Temple-guards enough time to run into their crossbowmen.
The turn after we had to stop because we ran out of time.

so Very many thanks for the help at building my Army-list, I'll keep all the lessons to heart and next time, I'll field my slann... Lack of magic is a real pain when fielding Lizardmen. you pretty much keep making losses untill you charge, and then take some more losses.

But anyway, I'll be posting my next Armylist here as well, based upon this one, to see any comments on it.

 

[Dubious_wolf]

The first list is actually about 340 point OVER.

I don't know if you played the team game with the list you posted first... but yeah. Chakax alone is 300+ points...

so first off
If you find the skinks are dying leave them at home. take some chameleon skinks instead I personally don't like skink skirmishers but most swear by them. Additionally rank and file skinks only have access to javalins

next, a skink priest, with dispel scroll.
this guy can sit in the corner for the battle and pick his nose for all I care, but the ability to stop a spell is invaluable. especially at lower point games, and it's not much but adding even just 1 to dispel roles is big when you start thinking about averages. it's an exponential gain sort of thing even just one immediately changes how you can deal with magic.

saurus
MOAR! your unit sizes should always be 20 minimum, Usually I run 24-30. Especially if you are running them with spears. Spears allow you to fight in 3 ranks, at 18 no matter how you configure the unit they aren't benefiting from the special rule. Thus points are being wasted.

Saurus cavalry,
I haven't seen a block of cavalry 10 strong even come close to earning it's points. 400 points for a 10 man unit with a sub par charge is no good. The ways I've seen them work best are out on the flanks smashing into the sides to deliver a well timed counter-charge, they are heavily armoured light cavalry in my opinion.

So now the good stuff.

I love me some supporting temple guard.
These guys run well on the support because they can benefit from the saurus warriors ranks and survivability. Lag them behind a block of saurus for a juicy flank charge. Not many infantry blocks can weather 15 S5 attacks on a flank.

Chakax.
I love this guy. He may be on the expensive side, but in a challenge he will usually come out on top, especially in the lower point brackets. Re-roll hits and has a S7 which hits first always? yeah this guy is dishing the hurt. Additionally all magic weapons count as the mundane equivalent, that to me is icing on the cake. (just one thing the re-roll "look out sir" only works if he has joined a slann unit. definitely a bummer but not huge.)

I like Saurus lists I usually run a heavy saurus list, they work well. The thing that kills them is average WS, and low, low Intiative. if you can make up for these with sheer number of attacks your golden.

 

[Raithial]

thanks ^_^ for the advice, and pointing out some mistakes I made ^_^;; whoops?

I'll take a lot of it into consideration, and into more extensive testing, and with the way that my list is improving since I came here, I'm very pleased.
I'm having a match tonight again, this time with another Lizardmen fanatic at my side, against (once again) Dark Elves and Ogres,we will both be fielding the same list that I just composed with your advice in it as well. (for convinience since he hasn't baught Chakax yet, I'll exchange the Eternity Warden for a Slann in this game, aided by a skink-chief.)
I'm sure I'll have a blast of a battle while I'm there.
My opponent will be Ogres, and my partner will fight the Dark elves, and with Chakax' challange rules he'd het squiched pretty badly by an Ogre Hero or worse, put in a giant's pants... o.o
plus a Slann is more usefull against someone who hasn't actually fielded any mages for a long long time :3

I'll post my next list in a day or so, to ask for more advice :3