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AoS 750 or 1000 points list for tournament

Discussion in 'Seraphon Army Lists' started by Nart, May 24, 2018.

  1. Nart
    Skink

    Nart New Member

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    Hello, everyone!

    We started playing Age of Sigmar in our club about a month ago and holding our first tournament at the beginning of June. It is still undecided if it will be 750 or 1000 points, so I prepared two lists.

    Missions will be: Knife to the Heart, Starstike, Scorched Earth. No named characters (mostly because Arkhan) and no triumphs.

    For 750 points:


    Allegiance: Seraphon

    Leaders
    Saurus Scar-Veteran on Carnosaur
    - War Spear
    - Artefact: Coronal Shield
    Saurus Scar-Veteran on Cold One
    - General
    - Trait: Thickly Scaled Hide
    - Artefact: Blade of Realities

    Battleline
    5 x Saurus Knights
    - Lances
    5 x Saurus Knights
    - Lances
    5 x Saurus Knights
    - Lances

    Battalions
    Firelance Starhost

    Total: 750 / 750
    Allies: 0 / 200
    Wounds: 49


    For 1000 points basically the same with some additions:

    Allegiance: Seraphon

    Leaders
    Saurus Scar-Veteran on Carnosaur
    - War Spear
    - Artefact: Coronal Shield
    Saurus Scar-Veteran on Cold One
    - General
    - Trait: Thickly Scaled Hide
    - Artefact: Blade of Realities
    Skink Starpriest

    Battleline
    5 x Saurus Knights
    - Lances
    5 x Saurus Knights
    - Lances
    5 x Saurus Knights
    - Lances
    10 x Saurus Warriors
    - Clubs

    Units
    1 x Salamanders

    Battalions
    Firelance Starhost

    Total: 970 / 1000
    Allies: 0 / 200
    Wounds: 66

    What I have is :

    ScarVet on Carno
    ScarVet on Cold One (converted)
    15x Saurus Knights
    20x Saurus Warriors
    Starpriest
    Oldblood on Foot

    Probably will get Priest soon and can convert a single Salamander.

    I will most likely be facing:

    - Death with a Vampyre on Zombie Dragon and some skeletons to support it;
    - Starter SCE;
    - Starter Khorne;
    - Sylvaneth;
    - Skryre Skaven.

    I tested secon list so far and found Cavalry very mobile, but neither killy nor durable. I liked ScarVet on CO as general, because of his rerolls and bonus bite. Carnosaur is a beast and doing exactly what I expect him to do. Warriors don't do anything in combat, but can score\defend objectives. I am concerned about artefacts so far. Incandescent Retrices is good, but one use and can fail. Prism is nice for support heroes. I think of giving it to skink starpriest in second list. Shield did fine in test, blinding Zombie Dragon. Zoetic Dial seems like a waste of slot. Blade of realities doesn't do much, but it's effect is permament. Should I consider Light of Dracothion on CO ScarVet?

    I'm also thinking about dropping CO ScarVet in first list and replacing with Starpriest, making Carno general. I'm a little scared to go with no magic, but will it really be worth it? CO ScarVet's command ability does so much for the Saurus.

    I will appretiate any advices on how to play with such lists.

    And finally a noob question: what would be better to add for the stuff I have - 40x Skinks or a Bastiladon? Both are good in it's own way, so I cannot decide what is better for small games which I plan to play for a while. Thanks!
     
  2. Aginor
    Slann

    Aginor Fifth Spawning

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    Welcome!

    Well.... Unfortunately the Firelance isn't exactly out strongest bataillon. I have won a decent number of games using it, but the luck factor is hight there as they are glass cannons (and yeah, if you take that into account their offensive capabilities aren't even that good).
    At 750 It might work pretty well though.

    At 1000... I'd replace the Saurus by Skinks if you can, just to have more wounds. 10 Saurus won't do much more than 20 Skinks but the latter will last longer.

    I am also not sure whether the Salamander is worth it, a single Salamander rarely does anything significant.

    A Bastiladon is always a nice choice, but concerning the Skinks you will have to decide: What play style do you prefer, and which models do you prefer visually. I tend to prefer Skinks.

    I think using the ScarVet on Cold One is a good idea. It will split the enemy up. Otherwise the enemy has that one target (the Carno) they have to bring down to win.
    On the other hand: If you fully buff the ScarVet on Carno up (using mystic shield on him, and the Starpriest's Serpent Staff, and taking Thicky Scaled Hide as the trait) he will be a significant tank.

    Artefacts:
    I like the Prism (if you don't have to move, it is basically another arcane bolt), the Blade (apply to any hero that has a good number of melee attacks on his weapon, such as a ScarVet on Carno), Light is... meh. Will probably get more important with the magic changes soon. Completely wasted if your enemy doesn't bring magic and only works once. Rectrices is a bit random but still OK, and Coronal Shield is pretty decent.
    In your list I would probably use Blade or Shield on the Carno, and Prism or Light on the ScarVet on Cold One.
     
  3. Crowsfoot
    Slann

    Crowsfoot Guardian of Paints Staff Member

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    At such low points 750, I would not take a Batallion get more wounds on the table.
     
  4. ILKAIN
    Cold One

    ILKAIN Active Member

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    This might be crazy and fun... weak to mortal wounds though. i would also advise agasint a battalion at 750... but this one isn't bad if they get into melee lol

    Eternal Starhost 130

    Eternity Warden 140
    -Coronal shield

    10x guard 200
    5x guard 100
    5x guard 100

    Skink priest with trappings 80
    -general
    -Master of Star rituals
    -Prism of Amontyk

    750/750
    31 wounds

    the guard have re rollable 2+ saves in this formation, and the priest has two chances to get off the 4+ rites. the prism gives him something to do from behind your guard, and provides a small boost to damage out put at low points cap. basically this formation wants to sit on an objective or get into melee fast and sit there... not moving gives boosts to guard and allows the prism to be used. def not tactically overwhelming.... but fun for a low points game.

    *EDIT*

    re-read and see that you don't have guard... might wanna find out if you can use those 20 warriors as guard for the games.
     
  5. Nart
    Skink

    Nart New Member

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    Thank you, everyone!

    Now the exact rules are 750 points, but with Triumphs. Unfortunately I don't have neither Skinks nor Guard. But since it is confirmed 750, I will be going for the first lists. And I just realized, that Firelance bonuses did literally nothing for me during the test - not a single 6 to-wound on charge. I made only one charge thanks to the bonus, and then knights died. Carno and CO did all the job by themselves with a little help of the priest. So I came up with this:

    Allegiance: Seraphon

    Leaders
    Saurus Scar-Veteran on Carnosaur (240)
    - War Spear
    - Artefact: Coronal Shield

    Saurus Scar-Veteran on Cold One (100)
    - General
    - Trait: Thickly Scaled Hide
    - Artefact: Blade of Realities

    Skink Starpriest (80)

    Battleline
    5 x Saurus Knights (100)
    - Lances
    5 x Saurus Knights (100)
    - Lances
    5 x Saurus Knights (100)
    - Lances

    Total: 720 / 750
    Allies: 0 / 200
    Wounds: 53

    So I'm taking a Starpriest instead of firelance. I decided to leave the artefactis, 'cause I don't expect much mages. Prism is tempting, but I'm afraid, that all my heroes will have to move a lot and priest will be too far from enemies - I want to keep him safe. 720 points will give me a chance of triumph too.

    I only think about replacing 5 knights with 10 saurus. Is that worth it? The other 10 knight will be combined in one unit then. I cannot take 10 and 5 knights because of drums. Warriors seem slower and less killy but deny more area.

    And just today I found out that there will be a team tournament in the middle of June too - now 1000 points per player. Now I will have time to buy something for it, but I need a strong list because environment is very competitive. No restrictions, missions are Duality of Death, Starstike, Scorched Earth. I have and idea about Eternal Starhost.

    Allegiance: Seraphon

    Leaders
    Saurus Eternity Warden (140)
    Skink Priest (80)
    - Priestly Trappings
    Slann Starmaster (260)
    - General
    - Trait: Vast Intellect
    - Artefact: Incandescent Rectrices

    Skink Starpriest (80)

    Battleline
    5 x Saurus Guard (100)
    5 x Saurus Guard (100)
    5 x Saurus Guard (100)

    Battalions
    Eternal Starhost (130)

    Total: 990 / 1000
    Allies: 0 / 200
    Wounds: 37

    Since it is a team tournament, I'll ask to fight armies with as little mortal wounds damage as possible. Slann will cast Curse of Fates on Priest to make celestial rite on 3+. I am afraid to lose on objectives, because guard is slow and will cripple if they get too far from Warden.

    Can you point me at some more strong lists for 1000 points? The only thing - there is absolutely no way I can get Shadowstrike Starhost or another Start Collecting.
     
  6. Aginor
    Slann

    Aginor Fifth Spawning

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    Unfortunately you can take only one artefact if you don't use a bataillion in your list.
    Otherwise looking OK.


    Awww that's what I was going to suggest. :(
     
  7. Nart
    Skink

    Nart New Member

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    Ah, yes, forgot about that, thank you! No Blade then.

    I'd like to take shadowstrike myself, but I cannot get both skinks and rippers in time. But I found a guy who can lend me some Guard.
     
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  8. Nart
    Skink

    Nart New Member

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    Ok, after a night and a half of a day of brainstorming, I found that this is the very best I can get:

    Allegiance: Seraphon

    Leaders
    Saurus Eternity Warden (140)
    - Artefact: Prism of Amyntok
    Skink Priest (80)
    - General
    - Priestly Trappings
    - Trait: Master of Star Rituals
    - Artefact: Incandescent Rectrices

    Battleline
    5 x Saurus Guard (100)
    5 x Saurus Guard (100)
    5 x Saurus Guard (100)

    Units
    1 x Salamanders (40)

    Behemoths
    Bastiladon (280)

    Battalions
    Eternal Starhost (130)

    Total: 970 / 1000
    Allies: 0 / 200
    Wounds: 37


    The list is very defensive, weak to mortal wounds and magic, but other way near unkillable. Duality of death should be in my favor thanks to healing bastiladon. Rerollable 4+ for rites should give me rerolls most of time. Harder for other two missions, but I will aim for a draw or killpoint victory. Bastiladon with Solar Engine gives some shooting, so I can threat enemies from distance. Zero magic protection though, but I find slann to expensive for 1000 points game. Prism will give me some mortal wounds and retrices will give me a chance to revive a priest. Salamander is just to fill 70 points gap. I'd like to take razordon instead but no way I can get the model.
     
  9. Aginor
    Slann

    Aginor Fifth Spawning

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    Pretty much.
    As long as your opponent has no reliable way of producing mortal wounds then you will be fine.
     
  10. Nart
    Skink

    Nart New Member

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    Ok, I tested the Eternal Starhost list and found it, well... so-so. I played against death - Vampire on Zombie Dragon, Winged Vampire, 40 skeletons, 10x Skeletons, 5x Dire Wolves - Legion of Blood. Mission - Duality of Death. I made every single celestial rite, so defence was formidable. I managed to teleport bastiladon to the place of power with Masters of Space and Time, and it left there for the rest of the game. Guard advanced to the midfield to support Bastiladon, heroes and Salamander were hiding behind guard. In Death's turn, Dragon took the other place of power and killed a couple of guard - I eventually failed 2+ rerollable. 40 skellies rised from nerby grave and charged bastilladon - made 3 wounds with 84 attacks. Here I understood that I can hope only for minor win, because I had literally nothing to kill healing zombie dragon with. I turtled bastiladon with guard and heroes. The rest of the game he tried to kill everything with the rest of his army but dragon - if dragon left the place of power he'd lost on points. But my nothing could break my perfect defences and by turn 5 dragon was only thing that death got on the table. I lost 12 out of 15 guard and that was it. I had a minor win - 15-15 but I killed more units.

    Slowness and vulnerability of my least are main problems of my list. I cannot spread too, because I'll lose +2 for guard save and celestial rites rerolls. Single failed 4+ rerollable against dragon's breath cost me 3 guard models. Single smite finished that very unit. 40 skeletons, on the other hand, did almost no damage - literally 6 wounds before they were dead.

    In short, the best I could have with this list is minor victory. The moment I move everything breaks apart. And I cannot kill anything, that doesn't come to me. Bastiladon cannot kill much without rerolls to-hit. And if enemy has means to snipe my heroes, it is the end.

    So I want to test another list:

    Allegiance: Seraphon

    Leaders
    Saurus Scar-Veteran on Carnosaur (240)
    - War Spear
    Skink Priest (80)
    - General
    - Priestly Trappings
    - Trait: Master of Star Rituals
    - Artefact: Incandescent Rectrices
    Skink Starpriest (80)

    Battleline
    5 x Saurus Knights (100)
    - Lances
    5 x Saurus Knights (100)
    - Lances
    5 x Saurus Knights (100)
    - Lances

    Behemoths
    Bastiladon (280)

    Total: 980 / 2000
    Allies: 0 / 400
    Wounds: 58

    With this list I have a little more mobitlity and can kill things.

    Carnosaur - as long as it charges, it kill stuff pretty good;
    Priest - rerollable celestial ritual. Vital part of the list;
    Starpriest - magic support. Mystic Shield or Summon Starlight are a lot of help;
    Battleline - I choose knights because of March move they can make. Can be critical for scorched earth or starstrike. Can buy time for Duality of Death;
    Bastiladon - can be backfield support or first line of defence - very flexible unit. Support fire from solar engine is nice too.

    The list has more wounds so less vulnerable to mortal wounds. The issues I see - wayless survivable against normal damage. More depoy choices = going second more times. Against some armies it can be critical. More risky - I have more chances for major win, but nothing to reliable hold objectives at my territory.

    Things to change:
    - I'd like to take 10 and 5 knights, but I can't due to WYSIWYG. I have 3 drummers :(. But I can take 10 warriors instead of 5 knights. I know, they are worse but can be left to score objectives it my territory. I can also take 5 guard instead;
    - replace all knights with guard. Less mobility, more durability. But without Starhost they are not that good. 3+ rerollable is still very cool;
    - take Scar-Vet on Cold One instead of 10 knights and make him general. Even less durability and even more killing power. Scar-Vet will give rerolls and bonus attacks for knights and, most importantly, carnosaur. On the other hand, no more reliable Celestial Rite.

    So what do you think? Is Eternal Starhost still better option?
     
  11. Aginor
    Slann

    Aginor Fifth Spawning

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    Hard to say. I like Knights but they have so far under-performed for me as they are glass cannons.
    I think it is worth a try but I still think against Death you would struggle, as the Knights would die to Skellies and then you have nothing except the Carnosaur and Bastiladon's combined force to kill the VLoZD. And the Carnosaur can be chaffed by Skellies.

    I play both Seraphon and Death (Deathrattle + VLoZD) and I honestly have no idea how my Seraphon would win against my undead, except maybe a Shadowstrike to kill the VLoZD.
     
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  12. Crowsfoot
    Slann

    Crowsfoot Guardian of Paints Staff Member

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    You have to play the objective as much as possible, Death just don't die, well they do but they don't stay dead :D

    We lack hard hitters to take them out, Shadowstrike is probably the best bet like you say or Kroak.
     
  13. Aginor
    Slann

    Aginor Fifth Spawning

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    I played a 1000 points Shadowstrike last Saturday in a 2v2 battle. We lost due to bad luck, but in the first round my enemy learned that even a Stardrake can die in one round if it is target of a Shadowstrike. Six Terradons and 40 Skinks attacking it was just too much. :)
    That's the only really hard hitting list we have (well, maybe Kroak but even that one is often combined with a Shadowstrike), and I am fairly confident it can kill a VLoZD, but otherwise.... yeah, we lack hard hitters.

    And I am not sure we can regularly outlast Death either. An Eternal Starhost like @Nart played it can outlast Skeletons, but is rather easily killed by mortal wounds if the enemy brings spells, while Skinks bring a lot more wounds to the table but die in droves if the enemy charges their Skellies in and uses Danse Macabre or so, just because of the loads of attacks and the Skinks' rather poor save.
     
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  14. Crowsfoot
    Slann

    Crowsfoot Guardian of Paints Staff Member

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    Yeah I agree, the new spells Death have can cause a lot of problems for any army
     
  15. Nart
    Skink

    Nart New Member

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    Thanks everyone for feedback! I found that I completely forgot -1 rend ignore for Guard, so I have to give it another try. Team tournament will not have sudden death rules so I look for objective-holding strategies.

    And here is a report from 750 points tournament.

    Round 1: Legion of Blood, Knife to the Heart

    Vampire with Wings
    Necromancers
    40x Sceletons
    5x Dire Wolves
    5x Hexwraiths

    Knife to the Heart

    He took skeletons to the grave, other stuff around his objective. I put cavalry in front - herores behind. I used this formation for all three games. I finish deploymend second and he chose me to go first. I march forward, securing his middle-field gravesites. I spread cavalry a bit and leave starpriest at home. In his turn he rises skeletons from the grave near his objective. Vampire and Hexwraiths go foward while Necromancer left at objective guarded by wolf pack. He mades successfull charge with skeletons (rolled 10) at my frontline cavalry. Hexwratihs charge the same squad and vampire goes for another. Skeletons and hexwraiths destroy their squad, but vampire fails to kill anythings. I pile-in with Carnosaur and CO Scar-Vet - to skeletons and hexwraiths respectively. Carno eats a lot of skeletons and even more lost to battleshock (total casualties were 17, I believe). CO Scarvet, however, does only 1 wound to hexwraiths. He wins initiative on turn 2, but does nothig exceptional - some more wounds on my Scarvets and a couple dead knights from vampire. On my turn I fall back with knights leaving space to charge for another squad that secured gravesite. They charge and kill Vampire, Carno eat some more skeletons and hexwraiths leave scar-veteran with single wound. And the game is over beacuse we somehow managed only to make 2 turns in an hour and a half. I killed 120 points (a Vampire) and he killed 100 (one knight squad) - system was, if draw on killed squads, count points of fully killed squads and compare. So minor victory for me.

    I think, I shouldn't march so war and stay in midfield, forcing him to spread. I didn't expect that 9" sceleton charge. They are not that scary with Coronal Shield and Summon Starlight combined even with 80+ attacks.

    Round 2: Sylvaneth, Starstrike

    Treelord Ancient
    10x Dryads
    10x Dryads
    3x Kurnoth with Bows

    He set up a groove at the centre of his territory and deploys Dryads in it, on the left of them - treelord screened by another dryad squad. He makes a mistake and places kurnoth in front of dryads - to reach my heroes easily. He places another wildwood right between us. Again he finishes deployment first and takes first turn. Treelord casts mystic shield on kurnoth. They shoot my CO Scarvet, but does nothing. On my turn I MoSaT Carno in front of kurnoth, cavalry enter wildwood with CO, starpriest left behind in cover. I fail 9 inch charge with carno, and the turn is other.

    I'm lucky to steal initiative though and charge kurnoth with carno, CO scarvet and a knight squad (even didn't lost any models in woods). Other cavalry squad left to secure oreshard, third squad marches closer to dryads in single groove. Unfortunately, with rerollable 3+ kurnoth lose only 3 wounds - not enough to kill model=no bloodroar. On his turn he focuses CO scarvet and kills him, while treelord charges carno and deal some wounds. However, he fails mystic shield on kurnoth and now can reroll only 1's on saves. I kill one kurnoth in combat phase and blood roar the two left. I lose one squad to dryads. Turn 3 - his double turn, but I get extremely lucky with second shard landing exactly on my starpriest! I lose carno and some more knights, but hold 2 out of 3 objectives. He moves dryads on objective in his territory. I consolidate with all knights (4 in 1 squad and 3 in another) to midfield shard, kill some dryads with arcane bolt from priest and that's it - my goal now is to get as much points as possible.

    On round 4 he wins initiative and teleport treelord closer to my starpriest, while left dryads go for knights. He shoot skink with staff but rolls 3 for damage - I'm saved! He fails charge with treelords, dryads do nothing and die from knights they charged. On my turn I screen priest with one squad of knights leaving other on central objective, but it matters little for there is no way he can catch up with me in points. Thank's to Summon Starlight, Treelord fails to kill both Starpriest and Knights. That's a major victory for Seraphon!

    It was a toughest and closest battle of the tournament - so much mortal wounds from wildwoods. But everything was according to my plan - kill kurnoth and dryads, then take objectives and kite treelord - he's very tough but cannot kill everything by himself. Bloodroar was a gamechanger for me - such an awesome ability!

    Round 3: Stormcast Eternals, Scorched Earth

    Lord-Celestant on Dracoth
    Lord-Reloctor
    5x Liberators
    5x Liberators
    5x Retributors

    Nothing to tell here. For some reason, Stormcast player left one of his objectives open. I used MoSaT on one squad of knights and burned it turn 1. He was expecting me to come for his other two objectives, but I didn't - simply scored my. On turn 4 he started to move at my direction - but that was too late. On turn 5 there was a little fun fight in the midfield, but it changed nothing as I was leading in points. So again, a major victory.

    In the end, I took 1st place with two major and one minor victories. We are still beginners, but I must admit everything went just as I expected. Now I want to have 40 skinks even more - they must be such awesome objective takers! Until them knights a decent replacement with their 14 inch march. Coronal Shield is great with Summon Starlight combination. I'm glad I didn't take firelance - did almost no mortal wounds with lance and never failed a single charge with knigts. All in all, list was decent indeed - not the best but did what it intended to do: fast strike in weakest point and then game for objectives.

    Thanks for reading and again thanks for help! I'll be back with reports from 1000 pts team tournament next time.
     
  16. Crowsfoot
    Slann

    Crowsfoot Guardian of Paints Staff Member

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    Nice reports and well done on winning :)
     
  17. Aginor
    Slann

    Aginor Fifth Spawning

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    Nice job, and thanks for the report!
     

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